The Law of Unintended Consequences Will Kick You In The Balls Every Time

[johan]

I was thinking more in terms of someone who sells goods. If everyone's paid more, then more people are buying the goods you're selling, so you're getting more income at the same time you're paying your employees more. Who might, in turn, use some of their money to pay for the goods you're selling as well.

You're talking about education, which is another topic, and probably falls under "use taxpayer money to provide education and training, so more people have opportunities to become better, and give more to society".

Ok so let the government subsidizes all the flight training. Got it. Good luck getting your senator to vote for that one.

But there are still lots of jobs in which goods aren't sold. What about those who provide services like a plumber? Plumbing is a wet dirty job. And it pays well because its a wet dirty job. But plumbers don't actually make and sell goods. At least not directly. So in your model, plumbers wouldn't really get paid any more money than they already do.

Except we then find that its more difficult for the owner of plumbing company to find and keep employees because now they can go work at Subway and stay clean and dry and make the same money as they did getting wet and dirty crawling under houses to fix pipes. So now what does our plumbing company owner do? I'll give you three guesses. He raises his pay and also raises his rates to make up the difference. Unless you think the government should pay for plumbing work too?

So what have we done? We've raise pay and in turn, raised prices. How is that better?

[abaris]

So what have we done? We've raise pay and in turn, raised prices. How is that better?

How about paying a living wage that doesn't automatically lead to inflation? I mean, flight school, all nice and dandy, but 20 bucks an hour is a dream wage for every worker.

In the past, people used to live and support a family on doing one job. And that wasn't all management positions. It doesn't take a genius to see that todays model is obviously wrong.

[vorlon13]

Here are some corn prices:

1960 $1.02/bushel

1965 $1.18/bushel

1970 $1.23/bushel

1975 $2.70/bushel

1980 $2.70/bushel

1985 $2.49/bushel

1990 $2.40/bushel

1995 $2.56/bushel

2000 $1.86/bushel

2005 $1.96/bushel

2010 $3.83/bushel

2015 $3.71/bushel


Were do I go to get commodity prices to keep up with inflation ??

[abaris]

Pretty meaningless, thank you.

[Minimalist]

Flight instructors tend to make about $20 per flight hour.

I shudder to think I may have flown on a plane with a pilot who was taught by someone making $20 an hour.

[Chad32]

I was thinking more in terms of someone who sells goods. If everyone's paid more, then more people are buying the goods you're selling, so you're getting more income at the same time you're paying your employees more. Who might, in turn, use some of their money to pay for the goods you're selling as well.

You're talking about education, which is another topic, and probably falls under "use taxpayer money to provide education and training, so more people have opportunities to become better, and give more to society".

Ok so let the government subsidizes all the flight training. Got it. Good luck getting your senator to vote for that one.

But there are still lots of jobs in which goods aren't sold. What about those who provide services like a plumber? Plumbing is a wet dirty job. And it pays well because its a wet dirty job. But plumbers don't actually make and sell goods. At least not directly. So in your model, plumbers wouldn't really get paid any more money than they already do.

Except we then find that its more difficult for the owner of plumbing company to find and keep employees because now they can go work at Subway and stay clean and dry and make the same money as they did getting wet and dirty crawling under houses to fix pipes. So now what does our plumbing company owner do? I'll give you three guesses. He raises his pay and also raises his rates to make up the difference. Unless you think the government should pay for plumbing work too?

So what have we done? We've raise pay and in turn, raised prices. How is that better?

If you can't figure out how to run a business as things stand, then you just won't be a business owner. That's how capitalism works. People shouldn't have to work multiple jobs just to make ends meat. We have to figure out how to keep people who work a full time job from also being poor and unable to feed their families. We've got trillions of dollars to throw at failing multimillion dollar businesses, or to shove into an already bloated military industrial complex, but not enough money to give everyone a living wage, and provide healthcare and education to the citizens? I don't buy it.

[vorlon13]

Flight instructors tend to make about $20 per flight hour.

I shudder to think I may have flown on a plane with a pilot who was taught by someone making $20 an hour.

Watch Air Disasters, Season 6, episode 5, Accident or Assassination.


How would you like to fly in a plane where both pilots had fake paperwork in their credentials?  Plane got in a bit of turbulence, and neither one of them knew what to do.

[johan]

Flight instructors tend to make about $20 per flight hour.

I shudder to think I may have flown on a plane with a pilot who was taught by someone making $20 an hour.

If you've ever flown on any kind of regional airline, you've trusted your life to someone who was making about $20 to fly you around. Pilot salaries, especially when low on the career ladder are not what most people think.

[Pat Mustard]

Flight instructors tend to make about $20 per flight hour.

I shudder to think I may have flown on a plane with a pilot who was taught by someone making $20 an hour.

You probably flew on a plane at some stage where the pilot had to pay for his breakfast cereal with food stamps, given the official US attitude to a fair day's pay for a fair day's work.

The problem with pay at the moment is that those who add the most value to a good or service (i.e. those at the bottom up to middle management) get paid less than what their value to the company is, whereas those who add the least value to a good or service (i.e. those at the top, in big companies*) get paid completely out of proportion to the value they bring to to the company.

*I'll exclude small companies as their structures can be a lot different than bigger entities, with the owner or senior manager often working in a very hands on situation, and more than those under them.