What the name of God is.

[Mystic]

No, we don't need more Imams or preachers or ministers or rabbis or monks. Our world has far too much religious division.

Dude, it's career advice, not a prescription for the world, and the more religious division within Islam, the better I think. If MK comes up with his own Islamic sect, all the better.

The Quran commands all men and woman to be Sages that teach the knowledge of the book to others just as they learned it. To be learned and free of attachment to this world, sincerely worship God, and teach the book to others and learn the knowledge themselves.

I don't believe in clergy class division of this labor.

[Brian37]

I don't speak for every atheist, nor do they speak for me. I think you should treat us as individuals.

Some atheists do say there there is no way to know. I hate those atheists putting it that way when what they really mean is that god/God claims cannot be falsified through scientific method.

I disagree. I am only "technically" and semantically only agnostic about the future. Currently though, my "God switch" is in the position of "off" as far as all past and present claims.

I don't like my fellow atheists claiming god claims cannot be falsified through scientific method. Victor Stenger in his book "The New Atheism" says that science DOES have something to say about god claims. I agree.

Not being able to see something directly is a fallacy. We can see the unseen indirectly through the sciences. It is why we know that black holes exist. It is why even a layperson knows wind exists even though it seems invisible we do see the effects it has on trees and bushes and leaves. 

I employ several factors in saying "God does not exist" and stand by that claim.

1. Ocham's Razor says that out of all claims people can make to attempt to fill in a gap, the postulated answer with the least baggage is going to be your most likely answer.

So, our species history has produced tons of dead myths and god claims nobody believes today, just like all the other god claims you rightfully reject. Ochams razor says to me that it is infinitely far more likely humans make them up.

2. Evolution PROVES that life evolved to gap fill. Life does not always have time to slow down to observe. Our fight and flight evolution lead our species to make bad guesses. We ended up projecting our own qualities on the world around us as a false perception as a placebo coping mechanism. By giving human qualities to say, volcanos, weather, animals, we created superstitions as a way to falsely "bargain" with the world around us. That did create groups and those groups grew larger even based on totally false claims. That in turn gave our species safety in numbers and more opportunity at resources and creating offspring.

3. We can detect the "unseen" through scientific method. It is why we have discovered black holes and particles smaller than an atom, like the Higgs/Bolson particle and neutrinos. It is because those unseen particles have an effect on the things we can see. Just like we can see a leaf blow across the road without seeing every individual molecule of our atmosphere which appears clear, which we call wind. 

I don't agree with my fellow atheists that we cant know. I'd only say that if the one claiming a god/God/deity/super natural is unwilling to test and falsify that claim in a neutral lab, it is a claim that is not worthy of consideration. But I wont back down off of the attitude, even if one is willing to try that, it will fail, for all the reasons I stated above.

NO I don't know the future. But I also wont waste my time on a claim if someone were claiming an invisible pink unicorn farted us into existence. i wont lose any sleep ditching that claim either.

I am going to make a thread of sciencetism. I will see you there. But in a couple of days since I have assignments due soon!

Knock it off Mystic. That slur is the same false attempt to demonize scientific method Christians use. 

Scientific method is not a religion. If it were it would be exclusive to one religion. If it were a religion there would be a religious test to use it. We have Christians on this website too. I rarely if ever see two people of different religions debatw who got it right on an atheist website. I most of the time Christians and Muslims, mostly simply stick to trying to convince atheists.

Ok so you think science is a religion? Which religion does it prop up, because I have seen threads here started by Christians arguing that science points to their bible. And I have seen you and Atlas argue that science points to the Koran. 

So if you stupidly want to call scientific method "scientism" then that would also make Christians dogmatic too when they claim science proves "fine tuning". 

I am the outsider that is telling you BOTH that science is a tool, not a religion. The hammer is a tool, it does not care about the personal bias of the person using it. 

Christians pull this horrible argument too. When you cant prove your position you try to demonize scientific method trying to equate it to being a religion itself.

---

Dude, it's career advice, not a prescription for the world, and the more religious division within Islam, the better I think. If MK comes up with his own Islamic sect, all the better.

The Quran commands all men and woman to be Sages that teach the knowledge of the book to others just as they learned it. To be learned and free of attachment to this world, sincerely worship God, and teach the book to others and learn the knowledge themselves.

I don't believe in clergy class division of this labor.

All holy books/writings make claims, make calls and have "demands". So? Still circular reasoning no matter who is pointing to whatever club's writings.

[Athene]

Oh, my Go...I mean, Connection. OP was just....so beautiful...

Thank you!

You're welcome!

[Harry Nevis]

I don't know how you define preaching but I never seen Atheist ever justify love or morality or value or even why they should strive for anything meaningful or believing in meaning.

You don't know the definintion of preaching?  Right.

Why would an atheist justify anything to you?

---

I am showing you God makes a living connection to him...and the connected to is Him although we never fully reach him, we know we are aiming in the right direction with the glorification, and so this is through the leader and guide of our time who's light extends to all things!

Not only that, but this is the true explanation of morality. Morality is a living reality we are obligated to, not some concept created by chemicals through evolution that is limited in some part of our biological brains that we are then obligated to follow or should follow or it's better for us to do so......

I showed an answer and when thought about, there is no other way for us to be connected then this. God is a living being, so his light and connection is a living being it's simple and manifest.

You've showed us your gullibility.  You've shown us what a fanatically closed mind you have.  You've shown us how any answer you come up with has to be the Truth.  That's about it.

---

I find this assertion very offensive.

Where do you guys ever justify it? Some of you believe in it, some of you just assert it it should be believed in, but where do you attempt to justify it? Show me one thread.

What's the point? Why do you want to know this?

---

I don't speak for every atheist, nor do they speak for me. I think you should treat us as individuals.

Some atheists do say there there is no way to know. I hate those atheists putting it that way when what they really mean is that god/God claims cannot be falsified through scientific method.

I disagree. I am only "technically" and semantically only agnostic about the future. Currently though, my "God switch" is in the position of "off" as far as all past and present claims.

I don't like my fellow atheists claiming god claims cannot be falsified through scientific method. Victor Stenger in his book "The New Atheism" says that science DOES have something to say about god claims. I agree.

Not being able to see something directly is a fallacy. We can see the unseen indirectly through the sciences. It is why we know that black holes exist. It is why even a layperson knows wind exists even though it seems invisible we do see the effects it has on trees and bushes and leaves. 

I employ several factors in saying "God does not exist" and stand by that claim.

1. Ocham's Razor says that out of all claims people can make to attempt to fill in a gap, the postulated answer with the least baggage is going to be your most likely answer.

So, our species history has produced tons of dead myths and god claims nobody believes today, just like all the other god claims you rightfully reject. Ochams razor says to me that it is infinitely far more likely humans make them up.

2. Evolution PROVES that life evolved to gap fill. Life does not always have time to slow down to observe. Our fight and flight evolution lead our species to make bad guesses. We ended up projecting our own qualities on the world around us as a false perception as a placebo coping mechanism. By giving human qualities to say, volcanos, weather, animals, we created superstitions as a way to falsely "bargain" with the world around us. That did create groups and those groups grew larger even based on totally false claims. That in turn gave our species safety in numbers and more opportunity at resources and creating offspring.

3. We can detect the "unseen" through scientific method. It is why we have discovered black holes and particles smaller than an atom, like the Higgs/Bolson particle and neutrinos. It is because those unseen particles have an effect on the things we can see. Just like we can see a leaf blow across the road without seeing every individual molecule of our atmosphere which appears clear, which we call wind. 

I don't agree with my fellow atheists that we cant know. I'd only say that if the one claiming a god/God/deity/super natural is unwilling to test and falsify that claim in a neutral lab, it is a claim that is not worthy of consideration. But I wont back down off of the attitude, even if one is willing to try that, it will fail, for all the reasons I stated above.

NO I don't know the future. But I also wont waste my time on a claim if someone were claiming an invisible pink unicorn farted us into existence. i wont lose any sleep ditching that claim either.

I am going to make a thread of sciencetism. I will see you there. But in a couple of days since I have assignments due soon!

Can't wait.  Try boning up on the defininition of "science" while you're at it.

[LastPoet]

MK, You are out of line. You don't know anyone here enough to make judgement calls on anybody.

[Cyberman]

You guys always talk about how there is no way to know God exists....all the time. So if he exists, how do we know? This is basically the implicit premise when you say.... Why should we believe in God.... you are implying there is no good reason, no connection.

You always say if God exists, how do we know which one, Brahma, Yahweh, etc... so the implicit premise is if he exists, we have no way to know which one......

I am showing you God makes a living connection to him...and the connected to is Him although we never fully reach him, we know we are aiming in the right direction with the glorification, and so this is through the leader and guide of our time who's light extends to all things!

Let me see if I can illustrate the problem.

If I show you a card trick and you ask me how I did it, and I say "beautifully!" or "with style!", I haven't actually answered the question have I?

[Alex K]

I find this assertion very offensive.

Where do you guys ever justify it? Some of you believe in it, some of you just assert it it should be believed in, but where do you attempt to justify it? Show me one thread.

Nah, Atheists never thinks about that general subject. Off the top of my head without research, spannig several centuries

https://www.amazon.com/Sense-Henri-Thiry...1604243686


https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/087140673...ref=plSrch


https://www.amazon.com/Unweaving-Rainbow...1413312662

We are going to die, and that makes us the lucky ones. Most people are never going to die because they are never going to be born. The potential people who could have been here in my place but who will in fact never see the light of day outnumber the sand grains of Arabia. Certainly those unborn ghosts include greater poets than Keats, scientists greater than Newton. We know this because the set of possible people allowed by our DNA so massively exceeds the set of actual people. In the teeth of these stupefying odds it is you and I, in our ordinariness, that are here.We privileged few, who won the lottery of birth against all odds, how dare we whine at our inevitable return to that prior state from which the vast majority have never stirred?

[Joods]

I've never seen a Theist really justify love or why they should strive for anything meaningful.

At least we try, Atheists don't even try.

MK,
I've always respected you because you've, for the most part, been one of the more pleasant theists on these boards, but this comment by you is just wrong. You have seen me post my agonizing story about my oldest on here before. About how my heart breaks daily because she has been parentally alienated from me. Still is to this day, two and a half years later.

If you cannot deduce the LOVE I have for a child I cannot get closure from, because she is still living and yet there is no contact, you don't need religion. You need empathy and compassion. And you need to learn to read and pay more attention.

Many parents are atheists. Just look at these forums. If you believe for one minute that not a single one of us is capable of demonstrating love, you my friend are more dimwitted than LR.

We do way more than try. Our love for anyone in our lives is fully justified in how we treat those loved ones and in how we feel and care about them.

At least we don't buy into the bullshit of a "loving" god who evidently has no problems with wiping out an entire population of the beings he put on earth in the first place.

There's no "justifying" that kind of love.

[LastPoet]

Yep, he crossed the line. Now he is just as dim witted as LR or Drich. A preacher, with no regard for what he means, just making sure to use fancyfull words absent reason that only shine in the minds of his fellow believers.

But since he told me how I think or live, then I say fuck you very much MK. You know nigh. You just pretend that you do.

[drfuzzy]

The name of god?  Ooh, that sounds fun. Since humans made up god, god has had thousands of names.
(The poor being must be terribly confused by now.  Probably answers to everything.)
Names.  Hmm.  Herman?  1001001111001?  404godnotfound?  IAMNOT?  
Eh, why don't we just wait until some superhuman something actually shows up and states a preference.  Until then, the whole topic is completely irrelevant to humanity.