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The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
#21
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
There seems to be a link between autism and smoking by the maternal grandmother, which is interesting, but probably not to anti-vaxxers.
I'm not anti-Christian. I'm anti-stupid.
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#22
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
(May 1, 2017 at 10:23 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: There seems to be a link between autism and smoking by the maternal grandmother, which is interesting, but probably not to anti-vaxxers.

Sounds like epigenetics to me. http://discovermagazine.com/2013/may/13-...your-genes

And yes it is because it supports the notion that autism is many times caused by toxicity during a human being's early life.


Edit: deleted response to another poster due to misunderstanding on my part.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly." 

-walsh
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#23
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
(May 1, 2017 at 10:21 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote:




The research is in and there is no link to autism.

Vaccines occasionally cause other issues but these are short term and always preferable to the disease they prevent.

To not vaccinate may be a choice but it is a dick move putting children at increased risk for no other reason than it is not currently fashionable to vaccinate.

The anti vaxxer thing is closely related to the anti intellectual movement that seems to be sweeping the world at the moment. "people are fed up with experts opinions" was said by a UK government minister recently!



You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid.

Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis.




 








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#24
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
Here's another super interesting video about methylation and how a decreased capacity may potentially raise the likelihood of conceiving a baby with genetic defects. It's the same reason why smoking, drinking, and some drugs increase the risk. Because too much toxicity during a human being's early life can cause lifelong defects.   



"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly." 

-walsh
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#25
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
No one anywhere ever, let alone doctors, claim "any number of vaccines on any person at any age is completely safe", that's inane. There are some risks, as with all medicines. They are right there in the package insert you get every time you get a vaccine

Not to say docs are perfect, or that the research has all been done.  More research IS being done, but so far none of it has found links between autism and vaccines.  Doctors in the US need to work for their patients more than their wallets, but good luck there.  It's better in other countries where their doc's aren't courted by

Even if autistic children do have a factor that does not allow their bodies to process certain materials as well as "normal" people, that is not evidence of anything causal.  There are many toxins in the base environment now, many more than in vaccines.  Thermisol isn't even in most vaccines anymore, so we can just drop that red herring now. There are no other heavy metals in vaccines.  

Quote:Scientific research does not show a connection between thimerosal and autism.

Research does not show any link between thimerosal in vaccines and autism, a neurodevelopmental disorder. Many well conducted studies have concluded that thimerosal in vaccines does not contribute to the development of autism.  Even after thimerosal was removed from almost all childhood vaccines, autism rates continued to increase, which is the opposite of what would be expected if thimerosal caused autism.
CDC - Thimerosal in Vaccines
The only vaccine left that has thimerosal in the US is the Flu vaccine, and you can request thimerosal free versions (which most actually are).
Most children today get exactly NO mercury/thimerosal from any vaccines at all, so what is this heavy metal issue being spoken of?

So, now that we have established that thimerosal has nothing to do with autism, what other toxins is it that are thought to be in vaccines that autistic kids aren't processing?
Serious question, I'd love to hear an answer to.

Anyway, today's savvy parents know the real risk of vaccines is seizures and seizure disorders, which I addressed earlier, with sources when asked (and of course got no response from the person asking for the sources).
“Eternity is a terrible thought. I mean, where's it going to end?” 
― Tom StoppardRosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
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#26
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
(May 1, 2017 at 10:21 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Yes, that is one of the sources I've seen regarding the link between autistic people and methylation issues. I never read anything from this Wakefield guy or even heard that name before. Anyway, it's an interesting video, if you're into that stuff and have time to watch it. 

I actually watched it on this other page (from the same site, Autism Research Institute), and also read the guidelines underneath. Their advice regarding vaccines is this:

 
Quote: Regarding vaccines
  • Parents are choosing which vaccines to give after careful consideration of the child’s history and genetic background. For instance, if a child was born prematurely or has had recurrent ear infections, or if the parents have a history of autoimmune disorders or allergies, then these are indicators that the infant or toddler might not respond well to a vaccine (and certainly not when several are given at one time).
  • If you decide to give a vaccine, make sure your child has not been ill recently or is not coming down with something. You also do not want to give a vaccine if the child has been on antibiotics or if they recently came off antibiotics. Ask for single-dose vials, and give one at a time, i.e., per visit. There are no long-term studies showing that giving multiple vaccines at once is a safe practice. I would also suggest priming your child’s immune system with immune-protective nutrients prior to vaccinating. You can give 250mg of Vitamin C, 2 or 3 Echinacea drops and ½ tsp. cod liver oil for a few days before and after the vaccine.
  • Summary: We don’t have all the answers. No one does. But let us consider the research that has already be done, the stories of improvement and recovery from parents who have traveled this difficult path, and let’s apply common-sense precautionary principles as we prepare for, and enter motherhood. None of them can harm you or your baby.
  • Maureen McDonnell has been a registered nurse for 33 years in the fields of childbirth education, clinical nutrition, labor and delivery, newborn nursery, and pediatrics.  Since the late 70s Maureen has been a vocal advocate and frequent lecturer promoting whole foods, green living and preventive health measures as the most logical and cost-effective methods for minimizing complications associated with pregnancy and birth, and reducing chronic illnesses in children. In 2008 Maureen co-founded Saving Our Kids, Healing Our Planet Green Expos http://www.SOKHOP.com and established the blog Raising Healthy Kids Naturally at http://www.RaisingHealthyKidsNaturally.blogspot.com.

The bottom line is, research in this area is still ongoing. 

One thing is true: there is a link between children who develop autism and children who have a genetic methylation problem. Among other things, having a methylation problem means you have a harder time producing glutathione which is the body's most powerful antioxidant and plays a major role in eliminating and processing the toxic chemicals and heavy metals that find their way into our bodies. A harsh chemical that is harmless to most people isn't necessarily harmless to those who have this genetic disorder, and how exactly that can effect their bodies and their brains (especially on unborn babies and newborns) is still being studied.        

To conclude right now that any number of vaccines on any person at any age is completely safe is, in my opinion, just as foolish as concluding that none of them ever are. That's why it is advised to learn about each vaccine individually and to discern whether or not it is applicable to your child, trying to space out the vaccines, and trying to get some of them done at a later age if doing so makes sense. I don't know why anyone would say this isn't a sensible approach. 

The shit I've been through in the past year has taught me to not just blindly follow whatever any doctor says, but I don't need to get started on that.

It's hard to even know where to start, so lets start with the vid. It is the same video. But notice the text below the video in your link compared to my link. The text in your link has nothing to do with the video, it talks about a completely different individual and different issues. Again, the video has nothing to do with vaccination, or vaccination/thimerosal causing autism. And this site now appears to be less than honest. 

Regarding Maureen McDowell's editorial and the http://www.SOKHOP.com link. While she does provide some common sense information, the amount of false or exaggerated information over rides any benefit for me personally. Do all of these naturopath things (no supporting scientific evidence), OMG pounds of chemicals in the house with no direct links for birth defects (there are some but she does not make them, just uses scare tactics), pull out you Hg amalgam dental fillings (debunked years ago), take a shit load of probiotics (no evidence that they do anything in healthy adults), get rid of EMF appliances (holy sheep shit), no drug has been proven safe during pregnancy (bull SHIT).......... Do I really need to go on? She is selling/promoting an outrageous crap to generate fear. If I continued on about all of the other bullshit this would quickly become a TL/DR. You might as well go live in a bubble (but not a plastic one). 

And I love this quote: "50% of all pregnancies end in a stillborn, miscarriage, birth defects or a chronic health problem," More bullshit. The references do not support any numbers even close. I tried googling as many ways as I could and only came up with a 25% number (23% for chronic health issue/mostly mental/some that could have a sociological cause)

Stop believing everything you read. Take it with a grain of salt, in this case, maybe a bag. And stop beating yourself up for what happened in the past. It's not your fault. 

 
I don't have an anger problem, I have an idiot problem.
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#27
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
I know the video is not about vaccines. It's mostly explaining the link between methylation issues and autism.

The reason it applies though, is because methylation is a way for the body to detoxify. So people with a methylation problem are more susceptible to toxins and need to be more careful of what they are exposed to. Especially unborn babies and new born babies.

Anyway, that's^ where all the suggestions from the ARI stem from. Since many pregnant women don't know whether they or their unborn child has methylation issues, it wouldn't hurt to try to take certain precautions.

Rest assured, I don't believe everything I read. I've done a lot of reading in the past year and a lot of it is super pro all vaccines without limits, and a lot of it is totally anti vax. The suggestions from the ARI about spacing out vaccines, waiting until the baby is a little older for some, and avoiding the ones that don't apply, is the position that made the most sense to me, given what I've learned about methylation and autism.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly." 

-walsh
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#28
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
I'm confused. If vaccines caused autism wouldn't you be able to 'become autistic'? Autistic children are born like that so how do vaccines that they haven't had yet cause it?
“What screws us up the most in life is the picture in our head of what it's supposed to be.”

Also if your signature makes my scrolling mess up "you're tacky and I hate you."
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#29
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
My son is still being assessed by doctors, psychiatrists, etc, because it is highly likely he is somewhere in the spectrum. I have lost so many nights of sleep due to his sensory overloads. I have been stared at by judgy parents and non-parents when someone touches his face to say he's cute and he has a meltdown. I have had to establish a routine for us and the lawrd be with us when we break it. I have had to learn how to be a parent specifically to this child of mine, because all my "wisdom" from parenting the first helped for nothing.

I don't believe vaccines cause autism, but let's suppose they do. Both my kids are up to date with their vaccinations. If it were proven that vaccines cause autism, would I vaccinate my kids and just take that risk? YES. Even with all I know from what we have gone through, I would do it again for my baby. Why? Because I LOVE him and rather have him alive and well in the spectrum than dead from a preventable disease.

Any idiots want to keep their kids unvaccinated, fine. Keep em away from the rest of the kids who aren't old enough to have all their vaccines yet.
"Hipster is what happens when young hot people do what old ladies do." -Exian
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#30
RE: The Truth about Vaccines:A quick refutation
(May 1, 2017 at 8:38 pm)mlmooney89 Wrote: I'm confused. If vaccines caused autism wouldn't you be able to 'become autistic'? Autistic children are born like that so how do vaccines that they haven't had yet cause it?

They are not always born like that. Neurological damage to the brain can happen at any point in early life, though the younger you are the more susceptible you are. Unborn babies and new born babies are at the highest risk.

(edit to add)
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly." 

-walsh
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