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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 3:56 pm
(This post was last modified: June 19, 2017 at 4:01 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(June 19, 2017 at 3:47 pm)alpha male Wrote: If my "probably" is just rhetorical, then we have the same position.
Nope, sorry, still here, still not killing my kid. You'll just have to be content to speak for yourself.
Quote:You're seeing it that way. I see it as showing both good and bad.
Good disobediance to god? Now we're getting somewhere.....and I honestly mean that, lol.
Quote:Try an atheist version - if you could save the lives of 50 children by killing your own child, would you do so? Can't you spin any answer as showing good or bad character, or a mixture of good and bad?
What's atheist about that, lol? Nope, in any case...if you hadn't worked it out by now killing my own kid is a categorical no. I'd kill someone else's kid, though...but I wouldn't waste a single breath trying to insist that I was morally right in doing so. Yet another situation I can comment on with certainty. Can I spin any answer to that question to be both good and bad, or indicative of good and bad character..not personally, no...but I'm probably not working on the same moral system..eh? I'm guessing you can. Unsurprising, from a system that maintains that there is goodness in a faith that compels one to filicide.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 4:05 pm
(June 19, 2017 at 3:56 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Unsurprising, from a system that maintains that there is goodness in a faith that compels one to filicide.
I haven't been compelled to filicide, and neither was Abraham.
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 4:09 pm
(This post was last modified: June 19, 2017 at 4:13 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(June 19, 2017 at 4:05 pm)alpha male Wrote: (June 19, 2017 at 3:56 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Unsurprising, from a system that maintains that there is goodness in a faith that compels one to filicide.
I haven't been compelled to filicide, and neither was Abraham.
Back to saying batshit things.....? That's the entire crux of the story...... God says, -"go up the mountain and kill your son" Abe says "okay".
You've insisted that his greater faithfulness made him go along with it. Agreed...........a faith that compelled to filicide.....your faith is maybe insufficient to compel you - but then again maybe not, again as you've instead. It still commands this loyalty..specifically.....the whole point of the story. Hell, it doesn't stop there. The compulsion is reenforced and restated in the NT, for christers like yourself. Jesus himself (allegedly) commands greater fealty than that showed to family.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 5:22 pm
(June 19, 2017 at 4:09 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Back to saying batshit things.....? That's the entire crux of the story...... God says, -"go up the mountain and kill your son" Abe says "okay".
Abraham also told his son that God would provide the sacrifice. God did provide the sacrifice. So, you - no dead child. Me - no dead child. Abraham - no dead child.
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 5:32 pm
(This post was last modified: June 19, 2017 at 5:34 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Already been down that road, twice - doesn't matter. Still conspiracy to commit, and attempted murder. God trolling Abe doesn't change his willingness to produce the body, your giving it consideration, my flat out refusal....or god's command to do so.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 5:38 pm
(June 19, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Already been down that road, twice - doesn't matter. Still conspiracy to commit, and attempted murder.
God didn't see it that way, and he was the judge in the matter.
Quote:God trolling Abe doesn't change his willingness to produce the body, your giving it consideration, my flat out refusal....or god's command to do so.
God commanded it knowing the outcome, and knowing that he would therefore have reason to bless Abraham. Have you actually read the account?
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 5:43 pm
(This post was last modified: June 19, 2017 at 5:53 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(June 19, 2017 at 5:38 pm)alpha male Wrote: (June 19, 2017 at 5:32 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Already been down that road, twice - doesn't matter. Still conspiracy to commit, and attempted murder.
God didn't see it that way, and he was the judge in the matter. Obviously not, you also consider it horrid, judge. I'm afraid that even gods mighty might doesn't make something other than what it is, let alone right.
Quote:God commanded it knowing the outcome, and knowing that he would therefore have reason to bless Abraham. Have you actually read the account?
None of that makes it something other than conspiracy to commit, and attempted murder. So they did it for a big payout....yeah, plenty of people do the same thing, for the same reason. They still go to jail. Hows it going for abraham and his descendants anyway? As usual, the accomplice gets the shaft, and the head conspirator walks away with the loot. Perhaps if god had afforded Abe the foreknowledge that he had, that every single promise made would be un-kept or worse..Abe would have told him to stuff his shit..like you and I would... probably. OFC, this is all just an establishment legend...so there's no way that Abe would have ever done anything other than what he did. / shrugs
-all of this, and we could have been discussing the good disobediance to divine commands that both you and I agree upon........a real shame, huh? That'd be about a million times more candid and classy than the standard internet apologist schtick. Guess we have more christian onion to peel after all. No nuanced, life, and goodness affirming version of modern christian faith for us today..just retrograde divine command shit.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 6:04 pm
An all knowing deity tests his followers, knowing the outcome already?
What's the point of the tests?
Dying to live, living to die.
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 6:20 pm
(June 19, 2017 at 6:04 pm)The Valkyrie Wrote: An all knowing deity tests his followers, knowing the outcome already?
What's the point of the tests?
Free will.
Wait... hold that reply. I should probably read through the thread before I go replying all willy nilly to random posts that I read.
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RE: 10 Questions Biblical Literalists Cannot Honestly Answer
June 19, 2017 at 6:35 pm
(This post was last modified: June 19, 2017 at 6:38 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
The free will to freely choose what you were always going to choose, in accordance with divine foreknowledge?
The point of the "test", in reality no test at all.... just a narrative.....was as an establishment legend for judaism, and more specifically as a morality tale for it's followers. Do what god says, no matter what it is. To do otherwise, or to doubt the order, is indicative of a lack of faith. This is a common story.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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