On the subject of Hell and Salvation

[Godscreated]

 It is divinely inspired no one man could put together a book like the Bible, let lone many mean over a few thousand years.

Its not one book but many, and no two christian denominations can agree on which books exactly should be part of The True Canon.

Wrong nearly all denominations see the Bible as God inspired and complete as it is. Yes there are many books contained within the greater book it is an example of what I said before, God inspired.

There were multiple councils and synods to determine which books are "in" and which arent. As far as i know, God wasnt part of any of those. If you wanna claim that all those people were divinely inspired, coming up with different canons, go ahead.

God was overseeing the whole process, not only were the writers God inspired so were those who God used to put together the greater book. God wouldn't have done one without the other, this is only logical even on a human level. The people who are trying to incorporate different books into the Bible are working unaided by God and for their own selfish reasons, they are not interested in what God wants.  

And....those books were written within a mere one thousand years, not more. Is age or duration a yardstick for determining the veracity of religious claims for you?

Moses penned the first five books, that was more than a thousand years before the birth of Christ Jesus. Duration? God has been in control of His plan from before the beginning of time, God has always been and by the way they are not claims they are spiritual facts for those who want what God is offering. For those who do not want what God is offering they are confusing and out of reach, why should God make sense out of what He has planned to those who will reject Him.

GC

[Abaddon_ire]

Well, this is technicolor precious

Abaddon_ire


Um no. Fredds link gives a date of approx. 1300 BC slap bang in the middle of the bronze age. 

Here are some quotes from the wikipedia page:

<snippage of bovine crap>
Nice dodge. Instead of addressing the issue at hand, hurl a wall of irrelevant quotes. That is so lame.

In our own time this tradition continues. Off the top of my head I can name Adam Phillips, Slavoj Zizek, Pierre Badiou, and Martha Nussbaum as interesting thinkers who have retold stories from Shakespeare or Greek drama to get across their own contemporary messages.

So did JRR Tolkien, JK Rowling and GRR Martin. Doesn't make dragons real just because they wrote about them.

You don't have to be Derrida to think that no one can read the original story -- we all read the story plus all the interpretations which have come since. 

So why have you not? Because it is quite obvious that you have only the superficial understanding from whatever sunday school you attended.

Thus even if the redactors of the Torah were using older stories, there is no reason to think of them at the intellectual level of illiterate Bronze Age goat herders. They were clearly not like that. You don't have to like the stories, or give them any importance in your own life, but condemning the redactors for being something they're not is bad scholarship. 

OK that passage has so much stupid in it that it is a challenge to unpick it. First, you claim that the holy word of your god had human editors. This alone puts you at odds with roughly 30% of christianity. Next, my claim (backed by evidence I note, unlike yours) was that people were literate long before you magic book. Of course they were not "like that" I claimed that literacy long predated the bible. You constructed a stupid strawman and promptly failed to even knock that over. Well done on the double fail. And in a final flourish you give...

You don't have to like the stories

Sure, there is nothing to like.

or give them any importance in your own life

Theres your problem. I am legally all signed up to a code of ethical practice. In addition to that I have a personal moral code. If I were stupid enough to believe in your bumper book of magic, I would have to chuck both by the wayside. You are quite happy to toss aside your own morals in favour of a magic sky fairy as described in a magic book. I am not. Which of us is the more moral?

but condemning the redactors for being something they're not is bad scholarship. 

See now you are claiming that your magic book is actually not the holy word of gunderscored. I hope you are intellectually suitably equipped to spot the glaring problem with that without needing me to paint by numbers. Or possibly crayon. How low can we go?

[Belacqua]

See now you are claiming that your magic book is actually not the holy word of gunderscored.

It may be that you have me mixed up with someone else. I have never been a Christian. I have been talking about historical facts and sources, not the truth of the stories.

Anyway, thank you for prompting me to think about this today. The goat-herder quote always seemed unfair to me, kind of like "cheese-eating surrender monkeys" -- fun to type but not of any help to people who want to be accurate. I respect fredd for his willingness to walk back the claim. And the opportunity to think about why it's wrong has clarified the issue for me.

[Fake Messiah]

Moses penned the first five books, that was more than a thousand years before the birth of Christ Jesus.

GC, you again demonstrate that you don't know shit about the Bible. I guess I could say you embarrass yourself, but you are already a joke, so... Imagine Moses writing this Deuteronomy 34:5 And Moses the servant of the Lord died there in Moab, as the Lord had said. He buried him in Moab, in the valley opposite Beth Peor, but to this day no one knows where his grave is.

Or, according to GC, Moses also wrote this: Numbers 12:3 Now Moses was a very humble man, more humble than anyone else on the face of the earth.

Really, GC, read the Bible before pretending to be an expert on it.

[Deesse23]

[possibletarian]

Moses penned the first five books, that was more than a thousand years before the birth of Christ Jesus. Duration? God has been in control of His plan from before the beginning of time, God has always been and by the way they are not claims they are spiritual facts for those who want what God is offering. For those who do not want what God is offering they are confusing and out of reach, why should God make sense out of what He has planned to those who will reject Him.

GC

*bold mine*

Let's put aside the gobshyte that went before and concentrate on the bold. This is exactly the excuse religionists, creeds, crackpots, conspiracy theorist of all ilks and kinds, they all more or less claim the same.  It's an open license for the gullible to allow themselves to be deceived fully.

[The Grand Nudger]

It's a silly statement coming from a christian, anyway, who asserts that god is never out of reach even if someone doesn't currently want what he's selling.  Just as silly is the idea that christian theology is confusing.  I understand it fine.  It's not confusing, just idiotic. 

That's why I'm not interested in what god is selling, even if god's existed and were actually selling that, which they aren't, lol.   It's just people saying idiotic shit. Honestly, it would be even more hilarious if gods really did exist and really were trolling the faithful by telling them to believe in shit that never happened. "God inspired".....? Yeah, sure..and the sun might inspire me to write a poem, too...that doesn't mean that the sun is vouching for the accuracy of that poems contents. People who say things like that should use their god-given brains more often.

It's a weasel word that allows the faithful not to be seen or heard saying the silly thing..the thing that they also know to be silly..even though they functionally or literally believe it. That a gods cosmic hand reached down with a divine pen and authored a magic book.

[downbeatplumb]

[Godscreated]

[Deesse23]

I'm glad you agree with me on the Bible, but for the table I have no idea what you are speaking of.

You didnt know that different christian denominations have different ideas of which books the "true bible" should contain? 
I pulled this out in response to your claim that the "bible" was inspired (or the writers were) by god. If these people cant agree on what the bible is supposed to be, and you claim god inspired all of  them, your argument is definitely flawed.

---

Who said God inspire all the denominations?

You did, in your last post: 

God was overseeing the whole process, not only were the writers God inspired so were those who God used to put together the greater book.