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Current time: September 18, 2019, 11:34 am

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Russians wanted to play chicken?
#1
Russians wanted to play chicken?
From what I can tell it looks like they flinched. Whats Donny and Uncle Vlad have to say? 





Wonder if the helicopter has video?
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#2
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
The US ship was retrieving a helicopter during this time, flinching probably means a accident involving the helicopter.
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#3
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
For two ships to end up that close to each other in a vast ocean and when they finally get within a hundred metres of each other, one of them is landing choppers and can't change course or speed. Bullshit.
It's two high school bullies bumping shoulders in the hallway.




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#4
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
I reckon there's a lot more to this than the US navy wants to give. the whole "We can't change course because we're landing helicopters" thing feels awfully cheap to me, it's clearly a dick measuring contest, seeing who'll back down first.

Also, this "you see the wake" shit is trash as well. As far as i can discern, we can't see the US ship's wake, which would actually let us see whether they were the one being approached, or the one doing the approaching. All that the russian wake tells us is that it was travelling in a straight line and had to turn to avoid the USN ship, not who did the approaching. Furthermore, from what little we see of the arse-end of the USN ship, there is little wake visible trailing behind, which would indicate a fairly sharp turn, which would further imply that they USN ship had done the approaching.

This is some real dick measuring going on, that shouldn't happen.
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#5
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
There's no reason they should be that close, unless both captains intended it to happen.
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#6
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
(June 8, 2019 at 7:17 pm)Chad32 Wrote: There's no reason they should be that close, unless both captains intended it to happen.

Not that it would be particularly out of character for either nation's navy. Both have a tendency to think they're in charge.
"He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. For if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes unto you."
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#7
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
(June 8, 2019 at 7:17 pm)Chad32 Wrote: There's no reason they should be that close, unless both captains intended it to happen.

Of course one captain wanted it to happen, and another declined to be seen backing down as it happened.   Turning the other cheek is generally not why these ships would have existed and belonged in organizations called “navies”.   The question is which ship wanted to to happen, and which declined to turn the other cheek.

Which side is which is actually besides the point.   The key point is these types of forceful encounter usually happen for very specific reasons.    Even captains of two antagonistic navies don’t usually just wake up one day and say “let”s just go harass the other guy wherever we meet him in the middle of the ocean, cuz we are like little punks on streets”.   Typically harassment happens because the side doing the harassing doesn’t want the other side to be at a specific location, and is trying to make it dangerous for the other side to stay.  This could be because one side claims a piece of sea and the other guy came to show the claim is not recognized, so the side making the claim harassed the other guy’s ships to make them go away.   The Chinese do this a lot in South China Sea, because the Chinese claim South China Sea, the US doesn’t recognize the claim and send warships through them routinely to show we don’t recognize their claims.   The Chinese then harass the American ships with close passages, cutting off us ships with abrupt turns, some times the Chinese trail cable cutters behind their warships during close encounters to cut off any underwater equipment the American ships trail behind them, like sonars and hydrophone, all to get American nerve on edge while in the claimed territory and make the american ship hurry out of there.

This also happen a lot near Russia when US sendcships buzzing near Russian territorial water or in water with disputed claims, like parts of Black Sea claimed by Russia but which the US asserts to belong to Ukraine.

But this event is odd because the US and Russia had no dispute in the region.    So why would either side do this?

The answer is probably because this is happening near to China, and although not in territory actually claimed by China, it is undoubtedly in territory closely monitored and kept iunder continuous surveillance by the Chinese Navy.   Russia wants to show China that Russia can and will side with China if Chinese relationship with the US worsens.  It is no coincidence this is happening exactly when President Xi of China just began an official state visit to Moscow, and China’s Huawei promised to upgrade Russian’s aging internet infrastructure to 5G before the US can make similar upgrades to American internet backbone.
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#8
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
Interesting points there. It'll be interesting to see how the Sino-Russian relationship goes in the coming months/years, then.
"He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. For if you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes unto you."
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#9
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
Then again, they are Russians. What ya gonna do?





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#10
RE: Russians wanted to play chicken?
(June 8, 2019 at 8:03 pm)Jello Wrote: Interesting points there. It'll be interesting to see how the Sino-Russian relationship goes in the coming months/years, then.

There is actually a lot of room for longer term and deeper strategic alliance between China and Russia.

1. Russia is in dire need of massive infrastructural investment after chronicle underinvestment beginning in the 1960s.   The Chinese have enormous amount of capital looking for opportunity to invest, and they are also the world leaders at the moment in basic infrastructural expertise and efficiency. 


2. Russia's attitude towards the US is rapidly also becoming the Chinese attitude towards the US

3. Russian Navy still has a sizable collection of soviet bequeathed large ships, but Russia has lost essentially all of the former Soviet naval infrastructure, much of which was in Ukraine, so Russia at this moment struggle to build any blue water surface ships larger than 4000 tons (frigate).   China at the moment has the world's largest and most efficient naval construction infrastructure and has the ability to build new and fairly sophisticated surface warship of all types from nuclear powered aircraft carriers to patrol boats at 2-3 times the rate of any other country, including the US.   Russia would dearly love to have support from Chinese warship building infrastructure to replace her rapidly aging Soviet bequeathed fleet.   Without Chinese help continued existence of significant Russian surface navy much past 2025 would be a pipe dream.

4. China may have commissioned tits own stealthy air superiority fighter way before the Russians, but it still uses Russian engines.  China has found it singularly difficult to close the gap in advanced aero engine with Russia and the west.   China would love to have access to the best Russian military aero engine technology, which is abreast of anything found outside the US, and only slightly behind American technology.    The Russians would delay love Chinese money and orders to allow Russia to continue to fund R&D on the scale needed to not fall behind the US and Europe

5. Chinese satellite and rocket industry may have exceeded the Russians on scale, but the Russians still has an edge in carrier rocket sophistication.  Chinese would dearly love to have Russian help in filling the gaps in their own technology and Russians again would love Chinese money and orders.

6. Chinese military has not had any actual combat experience since 1979, and not major combat experience since 1953.   There is no doubt the Russians have a lot to teach the Chinese military about the challenges of conducting modern military operation against real life adversaries.
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