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Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
#51
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
Actually GC your reasoning is sloppy 

1. Even though they could count that doesn't mean they were counting the stars or even knew they were counting different stars even constellations or anchor stars could be shifting. Nor would it matter how long they looked .

2. Alternatively how much of a leap would it be for them to have inferred their were even more then they could count or even see with their eyes 

3.
[Image: 2018-06-29-13-superbes-sites-facebook.jpg]
The human mind is a wondrous thing and the insinuation we needed some god being to inform us of the night sky rather then credit to human wonder and reason is calling the ancients idiots .
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.

Inuit Proverb

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#52
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 22, 2019 at 2:20 am)Godscreated Wrote: Now how is it that a man of that time could have written such a statement when there are only around 6000 stars visible to the naked eye in the darkest of night skies. Don't try and argue there are more visible stars than that, it is established fact and do not try and say that it's metaphorical because that is a literal statement from the scriptures, so tell me how the writer could have ever know that the stars are innumerable?

GC



Studies show untutored humans in Neolithic tribal societies tend to have instinctive facility to grasp number of things up to a couple of hundred, which also happen to be the maximum number of people a typical person instinctively place into immediate social circle.    When confronting any number more numerous than a couple of hundred the instinctive ability to envision the quantity fails and the quantity is vaguely said to be "innumerable".    The fact that we can conceive of quantity larger than that now is largely the results of the fact that we've intellectually created the concept of mathematical numbers that is multiples of fixed quantities we can grasp, such as 10.   Most Neolithic tribal societies seems not to have been equipped with that advantage.


So anything more than ~100-200, say 1000, 2000, 6000, or 6 million are all intuitively innumerable to them.



But, Had the ancient Hebrews literati in the bronze age been equipped with the intellectual advancement required to count up to 6000,  and the old farts who made up the story of what Yahweh said happen to have been one of the fortunate ones who had been educated in that skill, that still doesn't mean the number of starts in the sky is now countable.

You see, there is no definite cut off to how many stars are actually visible to the naked eye of any one individual.   6000 is a sort of figure determined in modern times by analyzing the brightness of stars with precision instruments, analyzing the visual acuity of large number of humans in precisely controlled conditions, and then deduced.     It says around 6000 stars exist in the sky that should be visually individually discernible to some humans of good but non-exceptional vision under very good seeing conditions.    It doesn't say Benny Ben Yahu can always see 6452 stars, no more, no less.     The reality is Benny will never be able see all 6452 stars that instruments say should fall within the extreme reaches of his visual acuity.   right off the bat, 50% of the sky would be invisible to him at any given time.  That 50% is always changing as earth rotates.   Unless he has developed a RELIABLE system to fix coordinates in the sky and exceptionally good cataloging skills, he could never be quite sure which of the fainter star is a new one to count, and which has already been counted.   If the Hebrews didn't put extraordinary attention to creating such a system of sky coordinates and catalogue, and we have no evidence they did, then counting accurately without massive confusion up to 6000 different stars would be a fool's errand.   They 6000 stars they can theoretically see, would remain too numerous to actually count.   So innumerable.

As if that would be the only thing making the stars Benny can sometimes see innumerable.    Most of the stars theoretically visible to the typical humans exist at the very edge of theoretical human visual acuity, and then only under very good seeing conditions.   Even an individual human's visual acuity varies day to day, hour to hour, even minute to minute.  The seeing conditions vary even more, and on just as fine a time scale.   So if Benny is so minded as to develop his coordinate system, find a means to keep the coordinates pinned to the rotating celestial sphere, and develop a catalogue to keep track of which stars he has counted and which is yet to count, he is till in trouble.   For those very faint stars, which is the majority of the 6000, he could never be absolutely sure if he is actually seeing it, or just seeing things, because variations in his visual acuity and the seeing condition means he think he barely discern a star there one moment, and the next moment it is gone.  

Again, innumerable.

As it turns out, the number 6000 you quoted is not entirely accurate.  It applied mainly to people with good but unexceptional visual acuity in good, but not truly exceptional seeing conditions.  On night with exceptionally dark, cool, still and clear skies, up to 4 times that many stars may be discerned by people with exceptional eye sight.    

So adam Ben sharp eye says there were 156 stars in that patch them there yesterday. You only see 12 today, and only ever thought you saw 40 on that really good night. Who is right?


So again, innumerable.


You really need to treat all evidence as being against your god then as being for your god, because your intellectual predilection is to see god in very shit stain on every piece of discarded toilet paper.   Therefore to be intellectually honest in pursuit of what is rather than what you want things to be, you must assume every piece of evidence is a piece of evidence against what you wish to see, so as to not let what you wish to see confuse you about what you are actually seeing.    You must explore every piece of evidence until there seem to be no conceivable way to explain it without invoking god, then your should explore the possibility that it in fact has other explanations some more.

Only after repeating that process several time, will you add this evidence to the leger for god.   Then remember all those other evidences you have not yet examined must be assumed to be against god, and you only have one for.

Only then can you honest say what you believe to be true is not merely an artifact of what you wish to be true.
[/quote]
Reply
#53
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 24, 2019 at 10:24 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote:
(July 22, 2019 at 2:20 am)Godscreated Wrote: Now how is it that a man of that time could have written such a statement when there are only around 6000 stars visible to the naked eye in the darkest of night skies. Don't try and argue there are more visible stars than that, it is established fact and do not try and say that it's metaphorical because that is a literal statement from the scriptures, so tell me how the writer could have ever know that the stars are innumerable?

GC



Studies show untutored humans in Neolithic tribal societies tend to have instinctive facility to grasp number of things up to a couple of hundred, which also happen to be the maximum number of people a typical person instinctively place into immediate social circle.    When confronting any number more numerous than a couple of hundred the instinctive ability to envision the quantity fails and the quantity is vaguely said to be "innumerable".    The fact that we can conceive of quantity larger than that now is largely the results of the fact that we've intellectually created the concept of mathematical numbers that is multiples of fixed quantities we can grasp, such as 10.   Most Neolithic tribal societies seems not to have been equipped with that advantage.


So anything more than ~100-200, say 1000, 2000, 6000, or 6 million are all intuitively innumerable to them.



But, Had the ancient Hebrews literati in the bronze age been equipped with the intellectual advancement required to count up to 6000,  and the old farts who made up the story of what Yahweh said happen to have been one of the fortunate ones who had been educated in that skill, that still doesn't mean the number of starts in the sky is now countable.

You see, there is no definite cut off to how many stars are actually visible to the naked eye of any one individual.   6000 is a sort of figure determined in modern times by analyzing the brightness of stars with precision instruments, analyzing the visual acuity of large number of humans in precisely controlled conditions, and then deduced.     It says around 6000 stars exist in the sky that should be visually individually discernible to some humans of good but non-exceptional vision under very good seeing conditions.    It doesn't say Benny Ben Yahu can always see 6452 stars, no more, no less.     The reality is Benny will never be able see all 6452 stars that instruments say should fall within the extreme reaches of his visual acuity.   right off the bat, 50% of the sky would be invisible to him at any given time.  That 50% is always changing as earth rotates.   Unless he has developed a RELIABLE system to fix coordinates in the sky and exceptionally good cataloging skills, he could never be quite sure which of the fainter star is a new one to count, and which has already been counted.   If the Hebrews didn't put extraordinary attention to creating such a system of sky coordinates and catalogue, and we have no evidence they did, then counting accurately without massive confusion up to 6000 different stars would be a fool's errand.   They 6000 stars they can theoretically see, would remain too numerous to actually count.   So innumerable.

As if that would be the only thing making the stars Benny can sometimes see innumerable.    Most of the stars theoretically visible to the typical humans exist at the very edge of theoretical human visual acuity, and then only under very good seeing conditions.   Even an individual human's visual acuity varies day to day, hour to hour, even minute to minute.  The seeing conditions vary even more, and on just as fine a time scale.   So if Benny is so minded as to develop his coordinate system, find a means to keep the coordinates pinned to the rotating celestial sphere, and develop a catalogue to keep track of which stars he has counted and which is yet to count, he is till in trouble.   For those very faint stars, which is the majority of the 6000, he could never be absolutely sure if he is actually seeing it, or just seeing things, because variations in his visual acuity and the seeing condition means he think he barely discern a star there one moment, and the next moment it is gone.  

Again, innumerable.

As it turns out, the number 6000 you quoted is not entirely accurate.  It applied mainly to people with good but unexceptional visual acuity in good, but not truly exceptional seeing conditions.  On night with exceptionally dark, cool, still and clear skies, up to 4 times that many stars may be discerned by people with exceptional eye sight.    

So adam Ben sharp eye says there were 156 stars in that patch them there yesterday. You only see 12 today, and only ever thought you saw 40 on that really good night. Who is right?


So again, innumerable.


You really need to treat all evidence as being against your god then as being for your god, because your intellectual predilection is to see god in very shit stain on every piece of discarded toilet paper.   Therefore to be intellectually honest in pursuit of what is rather than what you want things to be, you must assume every piece of evidence is a piece of evidence against what you wish to see, so as to not let what you wish to see confuse you about what you are actually seeing.    You must explore every piece of evidence until there seem to be no conceivable way to explain it without invoking god, then your should explore the possibility that it in fact has other explanations some more.

Only after repeating that process several time, will you add this evidence to the leger for god.   Then remember all those other evidences you have not yet examined must be assumed to be against god, and you only have one for.

Only then can you honest say what you believe to be true is not merely an artifact of what you wish to be true.
[/quote]

 All that crap to convince yourself that I'm wrong, probably the most pathetic thing I've seen presented yet. The ancient Egyptians used millions of stones to build the Great Pyramid, by what you have stated they would not have been able to plan the building of such a great structure. You also play with the number of stars as if they differed greatly in number from one person to another and you assume you know the eyesight of those who lived long ago, you are about the most ridiculous person here. On average some 6000 stars are visible to the naked eye, this is an established fact that you want to play games with. The ancients dealt with great numbers, some were vastly rich and owned vast herds of animal, jewels and money, yes they could count past 200 and only someone with out a brain would believe otherwise. You just can't stand it because I have introduced to the forum an unanswerable question unless God is part of it. I refuse to stay in a conversation with someone who denies the sensibility of proven fact.

GC

(July 24, 2019 at 5:41 am)Grandizer Wrote:
(July 24, 2019 at 12:40 am)Godscreated Wrote:  Lazy, lazy, lazy couldn't you look that up. The answer is around 6000, go learn something and then come back to the argument. You must be loonier than a goony bird. You think people couldn't count back then, they studied the night sky and knew more about it than most people today. In Israel the summer months were so hot even at night people slept on their roofs with the heavens as a ceiling. They could see very well the amount of stars in the sky because they were looking at them for months at a time. The idiot is not the people of old it's the one who believe them to be idiots.

GC

Well yeah, they saw a lot of stars, more than what most people in today's Western world see at night. So what exactly is remarkable about what you said earlier?

Is 6000 not a large number? If I see 100 ants on the ground, I'm going to think that's a lot of ants. What then if I saw 6000 of them?

 6000 ants are not an innumerable bunch. To you nothing about what I said could be remarkable because you haven't the mind to conceive such. As with the dummy before you I refuse to converse with those of limited thought and who can't understand a simple question. As most non- believers do you must take the truth and twist it so out of shape that it makes sense to you, believing the lie you have then created only shows how little reason you truly have.

GC

(July 24, 2019 at 3:23 am)Fake Messiah Wrote: Really GC, you look at the Milky Way at night and conclude there are only 6k stars there?

[Image: milky.jpg]

Or Omega Centauri globular star cluster - which was described in the ancient times - has 10 million stars.

Then again even if some scientists in ancient times believed there are 6k stars Bible was not written as something in line with science. Like a lot of people back then knew that Earth was a sphere and yet writers of the Bible thought it was flat. Or some ancient scientists started concluding that there are natural causes behind human diseases but not the writers of the Bible who still claimed human diseases were caused by demons and that praying and exorcism can heal people.
Also it is clear that writers of the Bible could not count the stars, like Jeremiah couldn't and he wrote in Jeremiah 33:22  "As the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured"

 I have seen the Milky Way with my own eyes, unaided. It is a sight to behold. It's not me who says there are only around 6000 stars that can be seen by the naked eye that comes from scientist, today's scientist, go look it up and quit being so stupid. By the way Jeremiah was writing what he heard from God not what he observed with his own eyes. You like the other two dummies will twist any truth into a lie just so you can justify your own feelings, how dishonest of you toward yourself, that is as pitiful as it gets. End of conversation with you the third dummy.

GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
Reply
#54
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 25, 2019 at 2:08 am)Godscreated Wrote:
(July 24, 2019 at 10:24 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote: Studies show untutored humans in Neolithic tribal societies tend to have instinctive facility to grasp number of things up to a couple of hundred, which also happen to be the maximum number of people a typical person instinctively place into immediate social circle.    When confronting any number more numerous than a couple of hundred the instinctive ability to envision the quantity fails and the quantity is vaguely said to be "innumerable".    The fact that we can conceive of quantity larger than that now is largely the results of the fact that we've intellectually created the concept of mathematical numbers that is multiples of fixed quantities we can grasp, such as 10.   Most Neolithic tribal societies seems not to have been equipped with that advantage.


So anything more than ~100-200, say 1000, 2000, 6000, or 6 million are all intuitively innumerable to them.



But, Had the ancient Hebrews literati in the bronze age been equipped with the intellectual advancement required to count up to 6000,  and the old farts who made up the story of what Yahweh said happen to have been one of the fortunate ones who had been educated in that skill, that still doesn't mean the number of starts in the sky is now countable.

You see, there is no definite cut off to how many stars are actually visible to the naked eye of any one individual.   6000 is a sort of figure determined in modern times by analyzing the brightness of stars with precision instruments, analyzing the visual acuity of large number of humans in precisely controlled conditions, and then deduced.     It says around 6000 stars exist in the sky that should be visually individually discernible to some humans of good but non-exceptional vision under very good seeing conditions.    It doesn't say Benny Ben Yahu can always see 6452 stars, no more, no less.     The reality is Benny will never be able see all 6452 stars that instruments say should fall within the extreme reaches of his visual acuity.   right off the bat, 50% of the sky would be invisible to him at any given time.  That 50% is always changing as earth rotates.   Unless he has developed a RELIABLE system to fix coordinates in the sky and exceptionally good cataloging skills, he could never be quite sure which of the fainter star is a new one to count, and which has already been counted.   If the Hebrews didn't put extraordinary attention to creating such a system of sky coordinates and catalogue, and we have no evidence they did, then counting accurately without massive confusion up to 6000 different stars would be a fool's errand.   They 6000 stars they can theoretically see, would remain too numerous to actually count.   So innumerable.

As if that would be the only thing making the stars Benny can sometimes see innumerable.    Most of the stars theoretically visible to the typical humans exist at the very edge of theoretical human visual acuity, and then only under very good seeing conditions.   Even an individual human's visual acuity varies day to day, hour to hour, even minute to minute.  The seeing conditions vary even more, and on just as fine a time scale.   So if Benny is so minded as to develop his coordinate system, find a means to keep the coordinates pinned to the rotating celestial sphere, and develop a catalogue to keep track of which stars he has counted and which is yet to count, he is till in trouble.   For those very faint stars, which is the majority of the 6000, he could never be absolutely sure if he is actually seeing it, or just seeing things, because variations in his visual acuity and the seeing condition means he think he barely discern a star there one moment, and the next moment it is gone.  

Again, innumerable.

As it turns out, the number 6000 you quoted is not entirely accurate.  It applied mainly to people with good but unexceptional visual acuity in good, but not truly exceptional seeing conditions.  On night with exceptionally dark, cool, still and clear skies, up to 4 times that many stars may be discerned by people with exceptional eye sight.    

So adam Ben sharp eye says there were 156 stars in that patch them there yesterday. You only see 12 today, and only ever thought you saw 40 on that really good night. Who is right?


So again, innumerable.


You really need to treat all evidence as being against your god then as being for your god, because your intellectual predilection is to see god in very shit stain on every piece of discarded toilet paper.   Therefore to be intellectually honest in pursuit of what is rather than what you want things to be, you must assume every piece of evidence is a piece of evidence against what you wish to see, so as to not let what you wish to see confuse you about what you are actually seeing.    You must explore every piece of evidence until there seem to be no conceivable way to explain it without invoking god, then your should explore the possibility that it in fact has other explanations some more.

Only after repeating that process several time, will you add this evidence to the leger for god.   Then remember all those other evidences you have not yet examined must be assumed to be against god, and you only have one for.

Only then can you honest say what you believe to be true is not merely an artifact of what you wish to be true.



 All that crap to convince yourself that I'm wrong, probably the most pathetic thing I've seen presented yet. The ancient Egyptians used millions of stones to build the Great Pyramid, by what you have stated they would not have been able to plan the building of such a great structure. You also play with the number of stars as if they differed greatly in number from one person to another and you assume you know the eyesight of those who lived long ago, you are about the most ridiculous person here. On average some 6000 stars are visible to the naked eye, this is an established fact that you want to play games with. The ancients dealt with great numbers, some were vastly rich and owned vast herds of animal, jewels and money, yes they could count past 200 and only someone with out a brain would believe otherwise. You just can't stand it because I have introduced to the forum an unanswerable question unless God is part of it. I refuse to stay in a conversation with someone who denies the sensibility of proven fact.

GC

Really?  Trust me, what I say is far less crappy than your Bible, in whole or in any part.   In fact it would be beyond the easy effort of any one person not exceptionally talented in, and Totally dedicated to life long pursuit of, manipulation and deceit to attain the level of crap you deem to be your holy bible.

What made you think tribal primitive who can believe in Yahweh can be compared to the Egyptians pyramid builders?

Where are the pyramids of king David?

Why do you suppose the Israelites before Hellenistic influence were never amongst those from the near and middle east whose architectural, mathematical or astronomical achievements were judged worthy of admiration by posterity?  

What made you think having a herd in the desert means you must be able to count them?  Do you need to know how many pebbles are in it to make a pile of roughly this size?

Have you counted what is the highest number of stars you can reliably see, and see if that is the same number on different nights?

There is no established fact regarding how many star each person can see under any given circumstance.

There is only the fact that 6,000 stars in the sky are sufficiently bright, when viewed from the base of the atmosphere,  as measured by instruments, to be within visual acuity of average human with good but not exception eye sight to discern in good seeing conditions, again as established again by measurements.

As it were, under extremely dark skys in clear and still air, from higher altitude, ie better seeing conditions than obtainable at sea level, an average person can in fact see many more than 6000 stars, try it, go to Hawaii and drive up the road to the top of Mauna Kea, it is estimated the average person can discern roughly 8,000-11,000 stars from roughly 10,000 feet.  There, once your eyes become completely dark adapted, you likely can discern even  more than 11,000 stars.  You can make out parts of the dim nebulosity  of Milky Way is in fact made up of individual star like droplets in a wet fog, each discernibly separate form the rest yet still too closely packed to be reliably countable by eye.

You want to try it?  You can get a vacation to big island of Hawaii out of it?    A good spot to verify this is outside the visitor center of the Mouna Kea observatory. 

Test the validity of your reflexive defence of your Bible?
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#55
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 25, 2019 at 2:08 am)Godscreated Wrote:  I have seen the Milky Way with my own eyes, unaided. It is a sight to behold. It's not me who says there are only around 6000 stars that can be seen by the naked eye that comes from scientist, today's scientist, go look it up and quit being so stupid.

Oh so you know today's science but, apparently, Abraham didn't know the science of his day. Abraham was too uneducated to know science and/or too stupid to count the stars in the sky when God told him "See if you can count the stars in heaven; thus will be your seed" to say "So 6 thousand, eh." Especially when in the same breath God said "and as sand on seashore" Abraham was too stupid to ask "So which one? Is it 6000 like stars or more like sand?"

But the thing is that idea of counting the visible stars didn't come till 18th century and William Herschel. Before that people thought stars could not be counted. And even today it is not set how many individual stars can be seen with the unaided eye, some say 4000 some say 10 000. So back when the Bible was written - you guessed it - stars were considered too numerous to count.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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#56
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 25, 2019 at 2:35 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: established again by measurements.

Hi again,

We sort of wandered off from our last discussion, so I wanted to ask you again...

You were saying that "fundamentalists" have cost society "a million" while giving back "only one." I've been thinking about this. 

First, again, I'm curious about how you're using the word "fundamentalist" here. Many sincere and strict religious people have not been fundamentalists. 

Second, I was thinking it would be interesting to look at what religions provide for their societies. I gave the example earlier of Chartres Cathedral, since I believe it is of lasting value. And it has been beneficial to France (for tourism, if nothing else). 

But clearly, simple examples like that won't be enough. Have you read the work of Émile Durkheim, for example? He was a sociologist who studied the role of religion in creating unity in cultures, allowing stability during social changes. He was a while ago, and I'm sure more modern research is available, but this would be the type of thing we ought to start with, I think. Marcel Mauss, Pierre Bourdieu, people like that.
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#57
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
Typical appropriation of the benefits of social organization.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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#58
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 25, 2019 at 2:08 am)Godscreated Wrote:
(July 24, 2019 at 5:41 am)Grandizer Wrote: Well yeah, they saw a lot of stars, more than what most people in today's Western world see at night. So what exactly is remarkable about what you said earlier?

Is 6000 not a large number? If I see 100 ants on the ground, I'm going to think that's a lot of ants. What then if I saw 6000 of them?

 6000 ants are not an innumerable bunch. To you nothing about what I said could be remarkable because you haven't the mind to conceive such. As with the dummy before you I refuse to converse with those of limited thought and who can't understand a simple question. As most non- believers do you must take the truth and twist it so out of shape that it makes sense to you, believing the lie you have then created only shows how little reason you truly have.
GC

Why this ego talk, GC? Just because I challenged you on what you said? The question was understood, and reasonable and intellectually honest answers were given to the question. Full stop.

Now hopefully you don't repeat this weak argument at a later time, when it has been adequately countered with you failing to provide a proper counter in return. Moral of the story: The ancient Israelites saw lots of stars in the night sky and were fascinated by the perceived innumerability of the stars. Hence, the passages in Genesis that talk about the stars being of a very high number. You don't need no God to tell you that.
Reply
#59
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
Quote:I have seen the Milky Way with my own eyes, unaided.

Then you are either lying or blind because looking at it one could easily come to the conclusion the stars stretch forever 

Quote: It's not me who says there are only around 6000 stars that can be seen by the naked eye that comes from scientist, today's scientist, go look it up and quit being so stupid.
Which changes nothing about what i said nor what ancient people observed  



Quote:By the way Jeremiah was writing what he heard from God not what he observed with his own eyes.
No the writer who wrote the story wrote he heard it from god . That says nothing about how the ancient jews came to this conclusion 




Quote:You like the other two dummies will twist any truth into a lie just so you can justify your own feelings, how dishonest of you toward yourself, that is as pitiful as it gets. End of conversation with you the third dummy.
Projection

(July 25, 2019 at 10:57 am)Grandizer Wrote:
(July 25, 2019 at 2:08 am)Godscreated Wrote:  6000 ants are not an innumerable bunch. To you nothing about what I said could be remarkable because you haven't the mind to conceive such. As with the dummy before you I refuse to converse with those of limited thought and who can't understand a simple question. As most non- believers do you must take the truth and twist it so out of shape that it makes sense to you, believing the lie you have then created only shows how little reason you truly have.
GC

Why this ego talk, GC? Just because I challenged you on what you said? The question was understood, and reasonable and intellectually honest answers were given to the question. Full stop.

Now hopefully you don't repeat this weak argument at a later time, when it has been adequately countered with you failing to provide a proper counter in return. Moral of the story: The ancient Israelites saw lots of stars in the night sky and were fascinated by the perceived innumerability of the stars. Hence, the passages in Genesis that talk about the stars being of a very high number. You don't need no God to tell you that.
And he has yet to prove they were even counting the stars on felt ant need to do so .And ants indeed look numberless especially if you can't tell them apart . You might be counting the same ant 5 times .
Seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy -- myself.

Inuit Proverb

Reply
#60
RE: Why Creationists don't realize the biblical Creation is just jewish mythology?
(July 20, 2019 at 5:42 am)android17ak47 Wrote: I've come to realize early on when I first turned away from faith 2 years ago, that the scriptures that both jews and christians use and believe are no more credible than any other older theology that we all have come to know as myths. I mean honestly, we don't take greek mythology and others seriously because the stories and claims in those myths have so much incorrect information about this earth and the cosmos that it's obvious no greek had been inspired by any all knowing god or gods. But we all, and this includes theists read those myths as literal claims, thus deeming those stories astronomically incorrect on so many levels.

What baffles me now, is that we have a world with the majority of believers who believe in the same god, that being Jehovah/Yahweh, but just like those other theological stories we all call myths, the claims within christian/jewish/muslim scriptures about the nature of this world and cosmos are just as incorrect as those we call myths. So my question is, how can an apologist have no problem calling other theologies myths but when facing the same fallacies that are litterally described in their bible, they pass these errors off as metaphores, yet still somehow say an all knowing true god was communicating with these jews and justify it's existence, but wouldn't dream of giving greek or hindu mythology a chance on the grounds that, the claims were "mysterious" metaphores not to be taken literally but the gods still exist and created everything. 

It is obvious to me that there was no more of a real god interacting with the jews , than there was with the greeks, hindus, ect...  and just like the reason we call other old theologies "myths", that being the things that come out of the mouths of these people who claimed a spiritual entity had spoken to them when noone else was around, this same reason why I say this god that the jews wrote about is as much of a delusion as the rest...
Theology has NOTHING to do with the Scriptures themselves. Scriptures DO NOT teach such nonsense! Theologies are completely manmade and completely useless. They are religion and a believe system to get you to heaven when you die--which is stupid! They are complete with a man-made hierarchy and money grubbing system. And everyone has an opinion--works, grace, etc, stupid, stupid, stupid! Yet, the Scriptural reality is how to live life, kickin' ass, abundantly, right here, right now! As you live your life! Whether you know what your doing or not! I DON'T JUDGE! Neither does God!


Jesus only asked us to follow Him. IT IS INSANE! Yes. Yet treasure non-the-less! 

At the end there is a book of lives! That's all that really matters. Did you live the life of His promise? Or, are you going to make an excuse out of what others taught you?

That excuse won't fly! If you are deceived by theology: you are self-deceived because God TOLD us to challenge everything!
My girlfriend thinks I'm a stalker. Well...she's not my girlfriend "yet".

I discovered a new vitamin that fights cancer. I call it ...B9

I also invented a diet pill. It works great but had to quit taking it because of the side effects. Turns out my penis is larger and my hair grew back. And whoa! If you think my hair is nice!

When does size truly matter? When it's TOO big!

I'm currently working on a new pill I call "Destenze". However...now my shoes don't fit.
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