[Serious] Time to embrace Islam!

[WinterHold]

Are you saying the gays had all come together?

No. But as the report says, Karachi -which is a Pakistani city- is full of gays.
Personally; I witnessed a similar phenomena in Saudi Arabia; the "House of Islam". School days were "gay days" or "bisexual days".

People always find a way to practice what they want; even if the price was forming underground communities and breaking the shell they are trapped in. Remember Europe and the Church; stepping on people and enforcing rules that aim to control without an obvious reason then that society would break the bottle.

[R00tKiT]

Do cops ignore rapes happening in their plain view where you're from? If not, what's your point?

My point is free will is a philosophical slippery slope, a retarded analogy with cops stopping rape just won't cut it.

Can you answer my questions instead of responding by raising another question?

You asked none. You just wanted to know why I claim that "most atheists from the West leave their fate for reasons specific to their religion", and my claim is almost a tautology (the valid type) that I observed from countless exchanges I had with nonreligious people.

Yes, I'm not fluent in Arabic. The only people who seem to think the Koran is convincing in Arabic are Muslims,

There is some survival bias embedded in this sentence. The only people who will become Muslims are the ones who think the Qur'an is convincing, and probably not the other way around . huh ?

It doesn't matter how poetic and aesthetic it is in the original Arabic, it's what it has to say that matters.

It actually matters when the text itself challenges you with its aesthetic aspect.

If your book loses so much in the translation (miraculous in the original, meh in translation), maybe it should have been written in a more translatable language in the first place.

the meh version was man made - since it is reasonable to assume translators are not gods - so the translation being meh is not the original text's mistake.

I don't expect ancient people who didn't know any better to behave according to modern moral understanding. I expect a real prophet of a real Allah to have a more prophetic morality.

I get it, you expect a real prophet to behave like you want him to behave, according to your specific moral background. Well, everyone expects the real no shit prophet to behave according to their own too.

Child marriage is wrong because of the danger to and abuse of the child.

Define child before complaining about how wrong something never happened is.

I don't expect an ordinary warlord who started a made-up religion to understand that. Islam is not unique in that regard, all the religions are made up.

Of course, please come up with a better version than the warlord's Qur'an.

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How can free will exist in the same universe as an omnipotent god?

Omnipotent god wanted humans to have free will, therefore free will.

Is that too hard to understand really?

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Then why aren't you a Scientologist?

I didn't claim religion is true because of its number of followers. I was just responding to your pathetic "second best" objection when you ran out of answers.

I count them as failures too.

Prove the failure.

Would a rudimentary sense of morality and justice and a skin slightly thicker than an over-ripe tomato be too much to ask? The "god" that you describe mopes worse than a teenager after their first breakup every time one of its creations has the temerity to exercise its free will. And all because your "god" was too witless to find a better way to deliver His Message than entrusting it to a 7th century pedophile.

Empty claims as usual.
He didn't made it in such a way you wouldn't rage about it.

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Meanwhile... New poll shows record number of Arabs now identify as “not religious”:
~50% young Tunisians
~33% young Libyans
~25% young Algerians
~20% young Egyptians

Like youth elsewhere, young Muslims are leaving religion in droves:

“NO TO RELIGION or sect,” cry the protesters in Iraq. “No to Islam, no to Christianity, revolt for the nation,” echo those in Lebanon. Across the Arab world people are turning against religious political parties and the clerics who helped bring them to power. Many appear to be giving up on Islam, too.

https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail...nd-leaders

I don't think you got the numbers straight for a start.

Just don't count on it disappearing any time sooner. Any time includes decades, centuries, millennium

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[The Architect Of Fate]

My point is free will is a philosophical slippery slope, a retarded analogy with cops stopping rape just won't cut it.

No it's really not cops prevent actions that are freely chosen so can god but he chooses not to .Furthermore god choose to create being with freewill in the first place .So anyway you slice it your god is not just .

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Of course, please come up with a better version than the warlord's Qur'an.

Why would an atheist start a religion? and this is a red herring

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[quote]

[Pat Mustard]

Omnipotent god wanted humans to have free will, therefore free will.

But if free will exists, god cannot be omnipotent. There is something over which it has no power, the will that is free.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Empty claims as usual.

He didn't made it in such a way you wouldn't rage about it. 

Actually this is the empty claim and an epic non answer

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Omnipotent god wanted humans to have free will, therefore free will.

This isn't an answer .Nor does it deal with the contradiction

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Omnipotent god wanted humans to have free will, therefore free will.

But if free will exists, god cannot be omnipotent.  There is something over which it has no power, the will that is free.

Not to mention it actually undermines his case

[EgoDeath]

Omnipotent god wanted humans to have free will, therefore free will.

But if free will exists, god cannot be omnipotent.  There is something over which it has no power, the will that is free.

Agreed. If god does not know the future, then god is not omniscient or omnipotent.

Also...

To the OP, I repeat my question:

Why should I embrace Islam over the other Abrahamic religions? In fact, why shouldn't I embrace Buddhism, or Jainism, or Sikhism?

[The Architect Of Fate]

You asked none. You just wanted to know why I claim that "most atheists from the West leave their fate for reasons specific to their religion", and my claim is almost a tautology (the valid type) that I observed from countless exchanges I had with nonreligious people.

No it's an assertion

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I didn't claim religion is true because of its number of followers. I was just responding to your pathetic "second best" objection when you ran out of answers.

A task you failed miserably at

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the meh version was man made - since it is reasonable to assume translators are not gods - so the translation being meh is not the original text's mistake.

Th fact a supposedly divine book would have meh versions speaks volumes

[R00tKiT]

No it's really not cops prevent actions that are freely chosen so can god but he chooses not to .Furthermore god choose to create being with freewill in the first place .So anyway you slice it your god is not just .

"Anyway you slice it" kind of answers should remind you of my warning : free will is a philosophical slippery slope.

Please refrain from mumbling quick objections until you have a sound case.

But if free will exists, god cannot be omnipotent.

Such a good looking sentence. Please prove it.

To the OP, I repeat my question:

Why should I embrace Islam over the other Abrahamic religions? In fact, why shouldn't I embrace Buddhism, or Jainism, or Sikhism?

Buddhism and Jainism reject any supernatural creator, therefore they won't be a significant upgrade over nonbelief.

I already gave two sufficient reasons to reject christianity and judaism. The first claims three gods in one, the second has absolutely no satisfactory answer to the problem of evil.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Define child before complaining about how wrong something never happened is.

It's well defined and yes it happened if your stories are true

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Please refrain from mumbling quick objections until you have a sound case.

Nah i'll stick o the fact that i have a sound case and all you have is evasion and empty rhetoric

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Such a good looking sentence. Please prove it.

Logic proves it and you are a lazy apologist most at least try and defend this one

[R00tKiT]

Define child before complaining about how wrong something never happened is.

It's well defined and yes it happened if you stories are true

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Please refrain from mumbling quick objections until you have a sound case.

Nah i'll stick o the fact that i have a sound case and all you have is evasion and empty rhetoric

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Such a good looking sentence. Please prove it.

Logic proves it and again for refutation you are a lazy apologist most at least try and defend this one

How old are you kid ? If you want to increase your messages counter try that elsewhere please.