Search for Causes

[possibletarian]

You guys ask if God exists why does he not openly reveal himself to  us. I  answer that he reveals himself directly to us as well as through the accounts of countless intelligent humans throughout human history to whom he has shown himself.

Unfortunately though he's very inconsistent with that showing, The religious cannot show us the difference between a god and no god leading us to believe that it's just made up. And those 'countless intelligent humans' believe in different gods and none.

You respond that is BS because science, which has no tool or method to determine this, cannot confirm the things to which I refer. Therefore, it is stupid to believe in God or any existence beyond what science has the capacity to discover or measure.

No it's not 'because science'  perhaps tell us a method we could use that isn't identical to it being a belief or all in the head ?

Well, I respect science and view it as an extremely valuable tool for discovering truth and is valuable for improving the human condition.  But there's no way I'm going to abandon my belief in God and the supernatural because of knowledge, or lack of such, obtained from a method that is not even equipped to make such a judgment.

That's because 'god' is literally made of nothing, and we cannot distinguish him from nothing, no matter how many sincerely believe.
There are many gods people no longer believe in, and yours is going the same way in educated nations.

I  can't take it seriously when you tell me that God cannot communicate himself to countless others and myself when you have no way of knowing that.  I prefer to use the method that is best equipped to determine the situation.

What method is that, and why do you think it's reliable, not only to us but more importantly to yourself ?

When you ask people to believe you have to show us a method to belief that is just not 'believing' which of course  can lead you to any god, religion, flat earth, alien abductions, conspiracy theory or literally anything,  This being a god who presumably wants us to know him yet provides exactly the same method used to believe literally any non existent god or crackpot idea!

[Deesse23]

If your method is *prayer* then its utterly ineffective. Think of all those people who pray to the *wrong* (aka not yours) god. If your god exists, THEIR prayer is useless. If THEIR god exists, your prayer is useless. Ergo: Prayer as a method is useless to find out who is praying to the *right* god.
How can prayer be an effective method to figure out truth anyway? It literally is wishful thinking, aka "please, god, make my wishes come true.....if you like". Prayer is not about finding out what is true, but about maing your wishes come true, and you have yourself admitted to it.

Think about it........but you wont.

[Mr.wizard]

My method is prayer and listening to God along with studying and considering alternatives. Then I try to drop the belief. If it doesn't go away I tend to believe it.

Prayer is not a reliable method for determining truth, we could pray for answers on any subject and come up with wildly differnet answers or absolutely no answers. If this is your method then you clearly arent intrested in finding out what is actually true.

[The Grand Nudger]

Not an issue for prayer, or religion. It's not concerned with what is true, but what we wish were true and might make so. That's it's explicit purpose.

Him telling us that he tends to believe whatever he believed yesterday is the operative belief-making principle described - not prayer. We pray in order to buttress the state of our beliefs, commonly believing that the state of belief we're in is insufficient. We pray because we have beliefs..not in order to acquire them.

[Brian37]

If I had an experience which I sincerely believed was God talking directly to me, how would I be able to prove or disprove what I believe?

If I had advanced stage cancer and it suddenly disappeared or went into remission, how could it be proven to be from natural, rather than supernatural causes?

If natural science was unable to determine the cause,  what method could I use to determine if the origin or cause of these was supernatural?  Should I pursue other avenues or rely on science to eventually come up with an answer?

Maybe you should simply consider no invisible being is talking to you, but you are talking to yourself based on your own wishful thinking.

[Lek]

My method is prayer and listening  to God

So, you’re starting with your conclusion then. You don’t see the obvious problem with that reasoning?

You left out the remainder of the sentence. It reads:

"My method is prayer and listening to God along with studying and considering alternatives."

[Deesse23]

"My method is prayer and listening to God along with studying and considering alternatives."

Does he speak to you?

[Lek]

If your method is *prayer* then its utterly ineffective. Think of all those people who pray to the *wrong* (aka not yours) god. If your god exists, THEIR prayer is useless. If THEIR god exists, your prayer is useless. Ergo: Prayer as a method is useless to find out who is praying to the *right* god.
How can prayer be an effective method to figure out truth anyway? It literally is wishful thinking, aka "please, god, make my wishes come true.....if you like". Prayer is not about finding out what is true, but about maing your wishes come true, and you have yourself admitted to it.

Think about it........but you wont.

This is not the case. There is only one God who, or which, is indescribable in human concepts. People of various faiths have come to know that God exists through his enlightening and from there different concepts have arisen in various cultures. Christians, Hindus, Muslims, Buddhists, Native Americans, etc all worship the same God because there is only one God, regardless of the various descriptions given of him. These different concepts are all possibilities arising from the truth of the ultimate reality.

Yes. I believe that all religions, that have arisen from a genuine search for the truth, are true because God has revealed his existence to them and is with them. Yet they are limited in their descriptions of God, which we are unable to conceive.

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"My method is prayer and listening to God along with studying and considering alternatives."

Does he speak to you?

I'd say he enlightens me in numerous ways.

[The Grand Nudger]

Are there any other fun euphemisms in that description of your process?

You mentioned that you can't take a person seriously when they strongly doubt that god does the things you say..but, then, you don't take them seriously either. People doubt that a god is talking to anyone. God isn't talking to you, god isn't talking to me, god isn't talking to any of the other posters.

We may have a small sample size, here, but thusfar god is talking to no one...including yourself. Correct?

[Lek]

Are there any other fun euphemisms in that description of your process?

I just tell it like I see it.