Judaism - What is judaism - When did it start?

[The Grand Nudger]

Judaism has its origins sometime in the immediate vicinity of 600bc. Before that, there was a shared culture of which they would have been a subsect. A lot of the ot prophets are espousing the judahite viewpoint leading up to the destruction of Israel and subsequent transportation to Babylon.

That event was seen as confirmation of the criticism they had with respect to the kingdom and people of Israel- who’d mixed the races, diluting the covenant, and abandoned what judahite authors believed to be their genuine sacred contents either explicitly, or by default of behavior. They would be punished by god for their transgressions, and sure enough, an army came marching over the hill.

The kingdom of Israel suffered disproportionate losses in the short conflict, and this would show both pre and post exile with the reformation and codification of a new culture in the aftermath of that tragedy. Irony being that the people who then returned were a distinct ethnicity and religion to both those groups which preceded them culturally and historically.

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TLDR version, Muslims are no more Christian than Christian’s are Jewish, no would it be accurate to conflate a Jewish person with a Hebrew person or a Hebrew with a Canaanite- even though the narratives that they each organize their societies around share a common literary heritage. There are five distinct gods with a relationship to a borrowed ladder. The only reason that there is ever any notion that they’re the same is when it serves the interests of god botherers to consolidate their social authority. Otherwise they’d just as soon and always have killed each other over it.

[Ferrocyanide]

Irony being that the people who then returned were a distinct ethnicity and religion to both those groups which preceded them culturally and historically.

They went from Babylon back to Israel (or whatever the name was back then). Why would they be distinct ethnically and religiously?
Did they intermarry with the babylonians and to what extent?
Did they modify judaism?

Muslims are no more Christian than Christian’s are Jewish

When I tell a christian, muslim, mormon that they are a jew, I don’t literally mean that they are EXACTLY a jew.
The idea is to make sure that they understand that someone took the original religion (one of the originals) which is judaism, they modified it to some extent and labeled it as “THE NEW RELIGION, the latest and greatest, the most correct, forget the previous one.”

The other thing that sometimes I mention is that most of these christians are of english, german, french background. Some call themselves american, some call themselves canadian.
I have spoken to 1 or 2 people from Sweden, different parts of Africa, etc.
All these people have dumped their own religion, the religion of their ancestors, and decided that a religion derived from judaism is the one true faith.

There are five distinct gods with a relationship to a borrowed ladder.

Yes, they are borrowing the ladder. In other words, they all have the same foundation, same Genesis, Exodus, etc. They all agree that god is real and he did interact with people such as Adam, Noah, Moses, Abraham and all the way to Jesus.

There is disagreement as to who Jesus was between christian sects and also between christian and muslim.

The only reason that there is ever any notion that they’re the same is when it serves the interests of god botherers to consolidate their social authority. Otherwise they’d just as soon and always have killed each other over it.

If they tell me that they are worshiping the same god, it is good enough for me. Also, it is clear that they (judaism, christianity, islam, mormonism) have the same foundation.
Whenever a new master leader comes, the new master leader doesn’t claim “Forget that god. I have a new god for you.”
That’s the way it was with Jesus.
That’s the way it was with Mohammed.
That’s the way it was with Joseph Smith.
Each one is just trying to tune up the religion, they are trying to deliver the corrected version.

So, I see a parallel between software and religion and also biological evolution.

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If I had to name them whales

You don't have to name them whales.

No one calls them whales. 

They aren't whales. 

Version numbers are irrelevant.

Everything you wrote there is true.

I would also add
Source:
https://animals.fandom.com/wiki/Pakicetidae
“Pakicetidae ("Pakistani whales") is an extinct mammalian family of carnivorous cetaceans that lived during the Early Eocene to Middle Eocene (55.8 mya—40.4 mya) Indo-Pakistan and existed for approximately 15.4 million years. Modern whales evolved from archaic whales such as basilosaurids, which in turn evolved from something like the amphibious ambulocetids, which themselves evolved from something like the land-dwelling pakicetids. All species are known only from a few sites in northern Pakistan, hence the name of the family, in a region which was coastal to the Tethys Sea when the pakicetids lived.“



There is a company called Apple.
They have a product called iPhone 10, iPhone 11, iPhone 12, etc.

They don’t have to call it iPhone 12.
The 12 is a version number.
Instead of calling it iPhone 12, they could call it Meztoriopazti

The OS running on it, they don’t have to call it iOS v 14.0. They could call it Mac Vizgo.

[The Grand Nudger]

I think I’d say that they don’t actually share any foundation. The beliefs arose in wildly disparate people across centuries and the circumstances each time different in nearly every regard.

-and yes, when you spend generations in a foreign land that has a noticeable effect on your ethnic and religious makeup. Some part of the ot narrative is -literally- returnees introducing themselves to the people who had never left or since came.

Hey, we’re back!
-who are you?
The rightful owners and rulers of this land!
-never heard of ya
Well sit down, we have a story.

There -was no- Judaism, if contemporary Judaism is the mold, before that defining event that so much of the ot is about. Kings, the prophetic works, the law- all of it records and contextualizes internecine conflict and waves of migration that weaken an exceedingly polarized culture sat in the middle of two more powerful regions whose armies laid waste to the space between as a casual matter of travel.

There are myths and foundational legends-yes, but much of it is comprised of what we would call socio-political commentary, today. Prophets are pundits who, from the pov of the disseminating interest, got more right than wrong on balance, and whose as yet unrealized prognostication satisfies the same as a desired past and future.

The arc of a peoples history with future triumph a given.

[Jehanne]

The early Jews were henotheists:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheism

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

The early Jews were henotheists:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheism

They were not. The henotheistic Yahwists were predecessors of the Jews (once you start practicing Judaism, you’re no longer a henotheist).

Boru

[Jehanne]

The early Jews were henotheists:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheism

They were not. The henotheistic Yahwists were predecessors of the Jews (once you start practicing Judaism, you’re no longer a henotheist).

Boru

Okay, I'll concede the technicality. A similar claim could be made with respect to Temple Judaism, which ceased to exist after the Romans destroyed the temple in 70 AD.

In any case, passages throughout the Pentateuch and elsewhere in the Old Testament allude to the early henotheistic beliefs. In fact, such is codified in the 1st Commandment, "Thou shalt have no other gods before me," which, of course, implies the existence of other Gods.

[Ferrocyanide]

There -was no- Judaism, if contemporary Judaism is the mold, before that defining event that so much of the ot is about.

Just to be clear, what you are saying is that before the captivity, before the judeans were taken to Babylon, there was no judaism?
So if the name of their religion is not judaism, then what was it?

Wikipedia mentions a date of circa 597 BCE as the first deportation and then there are 2 others a few years later.

There is Yahwism
Source:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahwism

So besides Yahwism and Judaism, I have not heard what the name of their religion is.

The arc of a peoples history with future triumph a given.

I’m not sure what you mean.

I think I’d say that they don’t actually share any foundation.

Oldandeasilyconfused says:
Judaism is the first of the three Abrahamic faiths. The other two being Christianity and Islam. The Prophet Abraham is revered in all three faiths.   The three faiths all worship the same one god.

So, if it is the first, then it is the first in the evolutionary line.
The people who invented christianity, they didn’t invent it on their own, right? Because otherwise, what is Genesis all the way to Malachi doing in the christian Bible? That’s 39 books.
I’m not claiming that christians took every jewish thought, every one of their books and inserted it into the Bible.
When you are evolving, it is ok to trash some of the books, some lines, some ideas.

The Quran or Koran is different. The stories are fragmentary. For example, it is still possible to see Genesis in there, but the lines are sprinkled here and there. Their Genesis is not an exact match for the jewish Genesis.

When it comes to mormons, they straight up give you the KJV of the Bible. They also give you the Book if Mormon which they consider the most perfect, uncorrupted holy book of all.

[Ranjr]

Is Judaism a Younger Religion Than Previously Thought?

A new book by an Israeli archaeologist makes the stunning claim that common Jewish practices emerged only a century or so before Jesus.

It’s the grandparent of Islam and Christianity and one of the world’s oldest surviving religions, by some counts dating back nearly 4,000 years. This, at least, has long been a common view of Judaism. But now an Israeli archaeologist is challenging those long-held assumptions.

Based on 15 years of studying textual and archaeological evidence, Yonatan Adler of Ariel University, in the West Bank, concludes that ordinary Judeans didn’t consistently celebrate Passover, hold the Sabbath sacred or practice other traditional forms of Jewish ritual until a century or so before the birth of Jesus. If his theory proves correct, then Judaism is, at best, Christianity’s elder sibling and a younger cousin to the religions of ancient Greece and Rome.

[LinuxGal]

The early Jews were henotheists:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheism

The Hebrews were henotheists.   By the time they were down to just the tribe of Judah, Levi. and Benjamin they were all on board with Yahweh as the only god.

[UniversesBoss]

Made up.