Isaiah 53, 700 B.C: Historical Evidence of the Divine Omniscience.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

For an entity that knows everything, this god of yours sure fucking stupid. Without a doubt, the dumbest thing in existence.

Or the dumbest thing in nonexistence, as it were.

Well, you gotta look at the worshippers.

"We're standing on the Titanic. We can get into boats or we can pray." We know how that worked out.

[Nishant Xavier]

I already gave some reasons why the Servant/Messiah is not Israel; the Servant is sinless and righteous, like the Sacrificial Lamb had to be without blemish, whereas Isaiah clearly says Israel was a sinful nation right from the beginning of his Book. This one point alone refutes that opinion. Second, the passage in Isaiah 49 clearly distinguishes the Servant from Israel, saying that the Servant's purpose is not to gather in only Israel (thus showing the Servant and Israel are distinct also), but also to bring God's Salvation to all the Gentiles, i.e. to the farthest ends of the Earth, as Jesus Christ has done. There were false messiahs in Jesus Christ's time, but none of them knew this hidden fact, that the Messiah must suffer and die for our sins. None of them also gathered any of the Gentiles to God, as Jesus Christ, the True Messiah alone did. It should be noted that the Messiah is sometimes called David to indicate He is a Son of David. In the same way, He can be called Israel to signify that He is a Son of Israel. He is a Son of Israel who alone will gather in all the Gentiles who believe in God also, so that Salvation may reach all.

It remains to show various Rabbis and Jewish Scholars, even post-Christian ones, who have themselves acknowledged Isaiah 53 is about King Messiah. The Messiah must be a Suffering Servant, suffer, Sacrifice and die for the sins of His People before He returns in Glory as Conquering King. We know the 2nd will come to pass because the first came to pass. Here are some testimonies from Rabbis/Jewish Scholars on Isaiah 53:

One of them gets it so astonishingly write he is almost Christian, he said: whoever will not admit the Messiah suffers for our sins must suffer for his own sins.

Readers following this issue can peruse this link for more sources: https://jewsforjesus.org/learn/whos-the-...-isaiah-53

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1st Century Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai: “The meaning of the words ‘bruised for our iniquities’ [Isaiah 53:5] is, that since the Messiah bears our iniquities, which produce the effect of his being bruised, it follows that whoso will not admit that the Messiah thus suffers for our iniquities, must endure and suffer them for them himself.“ 

The Babylonian Talmud: 
What is his [the Messiah’s] name? The Rabbis said: His name is “the leper scholar,” as it is written, “Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of God, and afflicted.” (Sanhedrin 98b)

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[Bucky Ball]

I already gave some reasons why the Servant/Messiah is not Israel; the Servant is sinless and righteous, like the Sacrificial Lamb had to be without blemish, whereas Isaiah clearly says Israel was a sinful nation right from the beginning of his Book. This one point alone refutes that opinion. Second, the passage in Isaiah 49 clearly distinguishes the Servant from Israel, saying that the Servant's purpose is not to gather in only Israel (thus showing the Servant and Israel are distinct also), but also to bring God's Salvation to all the Gentiles, i.e. to the farthest ends of the Earth, as Jesus Christ has done. There were false messiahs in Jesus Christ's time, but none of them knew this hidden fact, that the Messiah must suffer and die for our sins. None of them also gathered any of the Gentiles to God, as Jesus Christ, the True Messiah alone did. It should be noted that the Messiah is sometimes called David to indicate He is a Son of David. In the same way, He can be called Israel to signify that He is a Son of Israel. He is a Son of Israel who alone will gather in all the Gentiles who believe in God also, so that Salvation may reach all.

It remains to show various Rabbis and Jewish Scholars, even post-Christian ones, who have themselves acknowledged Isaiah 53 is about King Messiah. The Messiah must be a Suffering Servant, suffer, Sacrifice and die for the sins of His People before He returns in Glory as Conquering King. We know the 2nd will come to pass because the first came to pass. Here are some testimonies from Rabbis/Jewish Scholars on Isaiah 53:

One of them gets it so astonishingly write he is almost Christian, he said: whoever will not admit the Messiah suffers for our sins must suffer for his own sins.

Readers following this issue can peruse this link for more sources: https://jewsforjesus.org/learn/whos-the-...-isaiah-53

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1st Century Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai: “The meaning of the words ‘bruised for our iniquities’ [Isaiah 53:5] is, that since the Messiah bears our iniquities, which produce the effect of his being bruised, it follows that whoso will not admit that the Messiah thus suffers for our iniquities, must endure and suffer them for them himself.“ 

The Babylonian Talmud: 
What is his [the Messiah’s] name? The Rabbis said: His name is “the leper scholar,” as it is written, “Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him a leper, smitten of God, and afflicted.” (Sanhedrin 98b)

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Complete bullshit. We know nothing of the sort, and you have no education in the Bible or the OT. 
Isaiah talks all through that the servant is suffering is BECAUSE if the servant's sin. 
The Jews had monuments to all kinds of gods set up in their cities, and Isaiah told then THAT was why they were sent into exile.
There is NOTHING ANYWHERE about the suffering servant being sinless. You made that up.
It's the reason they were sent into exile, fool. You are also an ignoramus concerning the OT.
You really should stop trying to fake it. Jews for Jesus ..... LOLOLOL Can you READ ?

Isaiah 41:8-9
But you, Israel, my servant, Jacob, whom I have chosen, the offspring of Abraham, my friend; you whom I took from the ends of the earth, and called from its farthest corners, saying to you, “You are my servant, I have chosen you and not cast you off.”

Isaiah 44:1
But now hear, O Jacob my servant, Israel whom I have chosen!

Isaiah 44:21
Remember these things, O Jacob, and Israel, for you are my servant; I formed you; you are my servant; O Israel, you will not be forgotten by me.

Isaiah 45:4
For the sake of my servant Jacob, and Israel my chosen, I called you by your name, I name you, though you do not know me.

Isaiah 48:20
Go out from Babylon, flee from Chaldea, declare this with a shout of joy, proclaim it, send it out to the end of the earth; say, “The Lord has redeemed his servant Jacob!”

Isaiah 49:3
And he said to me, “You are my servant, Israel, in whom I will be glorified.”

[The Grand Nudger]

This is what happens when the social commentary of the ot is mashed together with the pagan notion of cyclical history.

[Nishant Xavier]

What rubbish. Bucky, you didn't answer the two Rabbinic sources I showed that understood Isaiah 53 of the Messiah. Here is 1 again without the quote box this time: "1st Century Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai: “The meaning of the words ‘bruised for our iniquities’ [Isaiah 53:5] is, that since the Messiah bears our iniquities, which produce the effect of his being bruised, it follows that whoso will not admit that the Messiah thus suffers for our iniquities, must endure and suffer them for them himself.“

I gave clear explanations for everything and don't have to repeat myself again. Let me just quote the rest of the Prophet Isaiah's Chapter 53 because it explains everything so clearly without need for Pharisaic sophistry. Prophet Isaiah is justly called the Fifth Evangelist. The reader will note: (1) The Sacrificial Lamb must be without blemish, according to Scripture and Jewish Tradition. (2) The Prophet says all of them like sheep have gone astray, that is, sinned. (3) The Servant/Messiah had no deceit in His Mouth. (4) Therefore, the Servant, Who is righteous, is not the people, as should be obvious (5) It clearly says He bore the sin of many, and was wrongly numbered among the transgressors, i.e. He was innocent. The Bible also says that none of us, fallen sinners, can be truly righteous. The Messiah is Righteous because He was the Sinless Son of God and the Suffering Savior. Israel was not without blemish, had done violence, was sinful, had not offered itself as a Blemishless Lamb for sinners, etc etc. If one wants to believe Pharisaic sophistry, one can. The better Jewish Scholars and the Prophet Isaiah himself are clear: this is King Messiah.

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We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
    each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
    the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
    yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
    and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
    so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away.
    Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
    for the transgression of my people he was punished.
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
    and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
    nor was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
    and though the Lord makes his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
    and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
    he will see the light of life and be satisfied;
by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
    and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,
    and he will divide the spoils with the strong,
because he poured out his life unto death,
    and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
    and made intercession for the transgressors."

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[The Grand Nudger]

Claims rabbinic authority, then complains about other sources being jewy sophists.

Perfect, no notes.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Bucky has answered all your nonsense and has kicked your ass in every thread thus far 

[Bucky Ball]

What rubbish. Bucky, you didn't answer the two Rabbinic sources I showed that understood Isaiah 53 of the Messiah. Here is 1 again without the quote box this time: "1st Century Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai: “The meaning of the words ‘bruised for our iniquities’ [Isaiah 53:5] is, that since the Messiah bears our iniquities, which produce the effect of his being bruised, it follows that whoso will not admit that the Messiah thus suffers for our iniquities, must endure and suffer them for them himself.“

I gave clear explanations for everything and don't have to repeat myself again.

Speaking of rubbish .... I must compliment your hermeneutic of insult as the way to share your faith. Jesus would be so proud of you.
Pushing your ignorant buttons is so much fun.

“Comfort, comfort my people, says your God.
Speak tenderly to Jerusalem, and proclaim to her
that her hard service has been completed,
that her sin has been paid for,
that she has received from the Lord’s hand
double for all her sins.” —Isaiah 40:1–2

Your god seems to be rather forgetful, rather than omniscient.
(BTW there are other examples where the Bible says your god regrets doing various things ... please make another thread and we can talk about those not-so-omniscient lapses.)

You're doing "prophesy" as "omen reading" again. It was forbidden. The role of a prophet was never to "tell the future". You're entire argument is without foundation in Hebrew culture.
You're using "prophecy" in a totally inauthentic manner. You really should take Bible 101.

You explained nothing and demonstrated how totally ignorant you are of this matter.
Your Fifth Evangelist BS is totally irrelevant, but does demonstrate your problem.

The use of the singular "he" and "his" is the NATION, just as it is in context in ALL the preceding chapters. 
You've wrested (LOL) this totally out of context because you work BACKWARDS. You work from what you want and need to find to support your FAITH to something you think
supports it, as you are not a scholar of anything, and are basically dishonest. Isaiah is talking in context as has been pointed out to you, the nation as a servant, not a single person. 

The role of the Jewish Messiah was NEVER EVER to "die for sin". 
You simply are totally ignorant of Hebrew culture and history. 
The Messiah was supposed to get the Kingdom of Israel restored, not to expiate sin. 

The Jews ALREADY had a temple / purification / sacrifice system which was quite satisfactory and sufficient for them. They had no need for anyone to suffer for sin. 
Their priest offered sufficient sacrifices every day in the temple according to their law. They didn't need a savior.
There is nowhere the Jewish Messiah has to be sinless, or die for sin. It simply was NEVER a part of that culture, as virtually every Jew knows. You made that up. 
The Messiah was supposed to arrive AT THE END OF DAYS and his tasks were not to die for sin.

You have your head so far up your Catholic ass, you can't see ANYTHING in any other context. 
Even Jesus' disciples did not think he came to die for sin. Acts 1:6 "When they therefore had come together, they asked of Him, saying, 'Lord, wilt Thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?'.
They STILL went to the temple every day, AND expiation of sin was not part of that culture. It was not what the messiah had to do.

Your 1 quote from Rabbi Shimon Ben Yochai proves absolutely nothing. First of all many many things had changed in Hebrew culture since the time of Isaiah. 
Little things like the rise of apocalypticism, the Essenes, ... the Romans, .... LOL just little things like that, and secondly you have to prove that this guy who lived as a hermit, ... that his thought was in the MAINSTREAM. You have failed in that. That's how history works. Maybe someday you'll get an education. 

https://www.jewfaq.org/mashiach
"The term "mashiach" literally means "the anointed one," and refers to the ancient practice of anointing kings with oil when they took the throne. The mashiach is the one who will be anointed as king in the End of Days."

"The word "mashiach" does not mean "savior." The notion of an innocent, divine or semi-divine being who will sacrifice himself to save us from the consequences of our own sins is a purely Christian concept that has no basis in Jewish thought. Unfortunately, this Christian concept has become so deeply ingrained in the English word "messiah" that this English word can no longer be used to refer to the Jewish concept.

It's very obvious (and widely accepted) that Isaiah had at least three authors, so I guess you're going to have to change it to the 5th, 6th and 7th evangelists. LOL
If there really only 4 evangelists and the number was limited to 4 gospels "because there are 4 winds and 4 pillars upon whish the earth stands" (Irenaeus) what about the other 2000 gospels ?  LOL

[h4ym4n]

I believe we are experiencing is a byproduct of home schooling.


Am I right X?

[GrandizerII]

"3 He was despised and rejected by others; a man of suffering and acquainted with infirmity, and as one from whom others hide their faces; he was despised, and we held him of no account. 4 Surely he has borne our infirmities and carried our diseases, yet we accounted him stricken, struck down by God, and afflicted. 5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, crushed for our iniquities; upon him was the punishment that made us whole, and by his bruises we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have all turned to our own way, and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all. 
7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; like a lamb that is led to the slaughter; and like a sheep that before its shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth. 8 By a perversion of justice he was taken away. Who could have imagined his future? For he was cut off from the land of the living, stricken for the transgression of my people."

In Isaiah 53, the first person plural is referring to the nations, and the man suffering because of their transgressions represents Israel. The passage is a poetic expression of hope for Israel, not a prediction about a particular individual.

Bucky is already addressing your points anyway, so looks like this was an unnecessary post.

Still, maybe another link might help you here:
https://aish.com/isaiah_53_the_suffering_servant/

Notice, btw, how easy it is to be misled by subtly inaccurate English translations (written by people who are primed to read Jesus into these passages).