Dear Atheists: what would convince you God/Christ is Real?

[arewethereyet]

Why is it that the representatives from the various faiths come here and try to insult us into believing what they believe?

Someone needs a better sales pitch.

[The Grand Nudger]

It's always the same. Theists say that things don't just pop into existence because that's ridiculous, but what they really mean is that only gods just pop into existence which is totally super serious and philosophical and not at all inconsistent.

@arewethereyet

They might want to look into finding a quality product too. It's gonna be hard to pitch dogwater no matter how you go about it. It always seems to me like they're the poor suckers who got saddled with a fuckin chevy because their dad had beef with the man at the ford service line.

[arewethereyet]

It's always the same.  Theists say that things don't just pop into existence because that's ridiculous, but what they really mean is that only gods just pop into existence which is totally super serious and philosophical and not at all inconsistent.

@arewethereyet

They might want to look into finding a quality product too.  It's gonna be hard to pitch dogwater no matter how you go about it.  It always seems to me like they're the poor suckers who got saddled with a fuckin chevy because their dad had beef with the man at the ford service line.

There is way too much proof that people will buy, or buy into, absolute crap.  It just seems the seller should at least try to make a good pitch.

[SimpleCaveman]

Hi Foxaèr,

Since theists can never seem to be capable of adequately defining god, they cannot really state with certainty thing is not a defining quality.

There is truth in theists not being able to adequately define god. Though I am a theist, I am trying to not come at this from that perspective but keeping it philosophical. (Or, at best, pop-philosophical)

And then we have to ask if thing is a defining quality of A (we don’t have to call it god), what does it mean to be a thing? Keeping in the same line as before, I take thing to mean something of this universe whether it’s quantum foam or latte foam. If that’s not what TGN meant, then I may need to adjust my statements.

If that’s what it means to be a thing and thing is a defining quality of A (god), then I, a pop-philosopher who is looking for the origin of all things, have to ask where did A come from? It’s still part of this universe and it can’t make itself. The essence of my latte is not to exist. Its existence doesn’t come from its ultimate nature. Its existence is conditional because it exists because of other things.

Now, if there is a part of this universe that comes from itself, or can make itself in some way, that would be interesting! What is there whose essence is existence? Whose existence is unconditional? I think that’s what that branch of philosophy is looking for. It would be even more interesting if that thing was then the source of all other things.

Pax et bonum

[SimpleCaveman]

It's always the same.  Theists say that things don't just pop into existence because that's ridiculous, but what they really mean is that only gods just pop into existence which is totally super serious and philosophical and not at all inconsistent.

Are you saying, then, that things do just pop into existence?

[Ravenshire]

It's always the same.  Theists say that things don't just pop into existence because that's ridiculous, but what they really mean is that only gods just pop into existence which is totally super serious and philosophical and not at all inconsistent.

Are you saying, then, that things do just pop into existence?

He seems to be saying you christers, in all your stripes, try to have their cake and eat it too.

[SimpleCaveman]

Are you saying, then, that things do just pop into existence?

He seems to be saying you christers, in all your stripes, try to have their cake and eat it too.

Thanks, Ravenshire. Sure, I get that. Silly me, though, I’m trying to take it back to the conversation.

Do things just pop into existence?

[The Grand Nudger]

It's always the same.  Theists say that things don't just pop into existence because that's ridiculous, but what they really mean is that only gods just pop into existence which is totally super serious and philosophical and not at all inconsistent.

Are you saying, then, that things do just pop into existence?

That does appear to be what christians actually believe, no matter what they say - which does put the ridiculous notion that they believe in gods because they don't believe things can pop into existence in a very awkward spot. Christians are super funny about this particular issue, what with their virgins giving birth to fully human godmen.

[SimpleCaveman]

Are you saying, then, that things do just pop into existence?

That does appear to be what christians actually believe,

Yes, I understand what you are saying that Christians believe.

My question, though, is what do you believe?

[The Grand Nudger]

Easy, I don't.

I don't know whether something can come from nothing, or whether nothing can exist...and I don't know how or even if the universe began. No belief I do hold leads me to a belief or a conclusion on either thing, and neither thing is a premise of any beliefs about anything that I do hold.