God Yahweh Allah was a volcano.

[Hannah]

Can you think of anything we might expect to find with say, a dig, were your interpretation correct?

Conversely, if your interpretation was not correct, would sort of evidence to the contrary could you conceive of?

A 3300 year old Bedouin gravesite in the hills north of Petra with evidence the man that been buried there was a priest of Aten would be a pretty good find. Short of that lots of things would provide further support for my argument. Egyptians were big on graffiti. “Elroy, high priest of Aten” scrawled into a cliff face at a Bedouin campsite is not out of the realm of possibility.

Seriously though, the point of my argument in this thread is not to provide proof that what I wrote is what happened. Rather my point is that it is arguable that the Exodus story might be more than a complete work of fiction. Some parts of the story could have a basis in historical fact. I’ve tried to provide an interpretation of some evidence in that light. I could lend further weight to that argument by providing more information on the details that are in the Exodus story about the Bedouin living in Edom. Details that are verifiable through non Biblical sources. However, I’m not arguing for the truth of Exodus as written so I’ve tried to avoid using those texts.

The Bedouin living sounds inline with the early OT. You are taking the scientific approach, which is to look at everything available including the Bible. It's not a story book. The Jews do have a past. They are extremely fastidious at keeping their religion and race pure so we should assume the Bible was written in order to keep a record of events. How accurate those events are we do not know yet. Supersition makes it fiction but not entirely.

[The Grand Nudger]

Again...."Abaham Lincoln, Vampire Hunter" has elements of non-fiction, that does not mean it doesn't get shelved in the fiction section. Hannah, you need to stop quoting the bible in support of the bible. If you want your theory to have any traction you need to find actual evidence that would turn our current understanding of the hebrew people as homegrown canaanites on it's head. Or at least evidence which erodes the idea, at the very least. The bible IS a storybook, why on earth do you keep insiting that it is not, without providing any evidence that it is not, in the face of mountains of evidence that it is?

Of course the hebrews have a history, the only problem is that the history in the OT does not match the history we find buried in the sand. No one here is arguing that the ancient hebrew people do not have a history, or that the authors of the bible could not have drawn on factual information to form the setting or characters of their fable. No one is arguing with you on any of those points. We are merely pointing out that we do have a history of the area, and of the people, and that this history is not equivalent to the history of the bible. In fact, it is so wildly divergent that the only word one is left with to describe the narrative of the bible....is fiction. The theory which you propose would be a credible one, worth looking into, except that we already have (which is all we're trying to convey here). Not that this should stop you, many times history has been turned on it's head by a clever discovery, so get out there and dig up the history you've presented us with.

[thesummerqueen]

They are extremely fastidious at keeping their religion and race pure so we should assume the Bible was written in order to keep a record of events.

haahahahahahahahahahahaha

Seriously?

There were PLENTY of times where they intermarried with Greeks alone, let alone any of the other Semite tribes, as well as the rest of the peoples we've been forced to live amongst since the Diaspora.

People will have sex with just about anyone or anything - don't make Jews more elite than they already think they are.

[Hannah]

By the way, when looking for references to Hebrews and Israelites, look also for HBR as there were no vowels in Hebrew. This is interesting as Habiru, the people who lived on the edge of society in Egypt, would have the same written name as Hebrew.....HBR.

[thesummerqueen]

Also, the Jews/Hebrews/etc were not immune to influences from outside religions, or even dissent among their own peoples. This continues down to this day. No religion is "pure."

[The Grand Nudger]

Christ, back again with the Habiru, are you hoping that we've already forgotten where that notion got wrecked? Look, The OT is a rehash of older creation and origins epics that were common in Babylonian and Persian culture. This is understandable, since we absolutely know that the hebrews spent time in (or subject to) these places, as opposed to you hypothetical wanderings in the desert. It would be strange to imagine that they independently conjured up a babylonian god based on sand volcano sightings. Especially considering that they didn't have to leave their homes to find these stories. That is the essence of why it is not a history.

[thesummerqueen]

Well said. Chuck and Leighton on the Irreligiosophy podcast actually gave a fairly comprehensive analysis of all this over a couple episodes - punctuated with cursing and the necessary ridicule it deserved. I suggest you look it up, Hannah.

[The Grand Nudger]

Do those shorts have little lacey black fringe?

[thesummerqueen]

It's a pleated skirt, and yes.

[Hannah]

Exodus 12
12:35 And the children of Israel did according to the word of Moses; and they borrowed of the Egyptians jewels of silver, and jewels of gold, and raiment:
12:36 And the LORD gave the people favour in the sight of the Egyptians, so that they lent unto them such things as they required. And they spoiled the Egyptians.

'Spoil' means loot from and not treat. 'Spoils of war'.

If the Hebrews really were in Egypt, they left with lots of Egyptian gold and silver. That would explain why the Egyptian army gave chase despite allowing them to leave....they realised they'd left with their valuables.

I believe the Egyptians were good record keepers. This would mean the Hebrews were either the Habiru or they were never in Egypt. If the Hebrews had been in Egypt and had been different to the Habiru, we would now find records of them or references to them. They would have been recorded like the Habiru. Also, for the Hebrews to have been able to steal gold and silver they must have had access to gold and silver, which slaves would not have done. They must have been working for the Egyptians in a trusted role. I believe the Habiru were sometimes employed in more senior roles.