(July 29, 2015 at 2:38 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 12:29 pm)Redbeard The Pink Wrote: No, you don't. You just think you know because you don't understand the basis of knowledge.

And yes, I did believe as you do. In fact, I probably believed even more strongly than you. Being a natural empath, my emotions are powerful and I feel them deeply, which is probably why it took so long for my logic to unseat my faith. If I hadn't believed as strongly as I had, I certainly would have de-converted sooner, and I wouldn't have been so deep into ministry and prayer rituals. I even kicked a "ghost" out of someone's house one time, and did a good enough job that it fooled everyone involved (myself included).

I know full well the kind of mental gymnastics it takes for an otherwise sound, intelligent mind to protect its faith in non-evident phenomena. Your insistence that you know what I do or don't believe is only more evidence that you are a pretentious, presumptuous, self-righteous shitbag.

 Now who's putting words in someone else mouth. I know God is real, that He exists, so you couldn't have known what I know or you couldn't ever be an atheist. You could say you've walked away from God, but you couldn't say He's not real. Can't help you have mental issues about ghosts, you might want to get that checked out. I'm none of the above, I love God and know that He will always be with me, and again your death will tell you everything about God, unless you reconsider you present belief.

Gc

You're sounding ever more desperate GC, maybe you should try the buddhist approach.

(July 29, 2015 at 2:03 pm)SnakeOilWarrior Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 11:47 am)Godschild Wrote: Unlike you I know for sure.

GC

No, you don't. You believe. That is not the same as knowing.

Really, I believe I'm alive and guess what I am. yes I'm positive God is real.

GC

(July 29, 2015 at 2:25 pm)Neimenovic Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 1:40 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: And again I ask if atheism is true and there is no ultimate meaning except for what each person finds for themselves, how is sharing their beliefs "harming others"?  Harming in what way?  Could that not be flipped around in you proselytizing you belief that there is no God on me, "harming me"?  Now for sake of argument, let's forget about the radical bible thumpers yelling from the street corner, because I would be right next to you yelling at those morons.  But in normal everyday conversation if you meet someone that says they are a Christian do you feel it necessary to engage them on that point?  Or do you reserve the engaging only if they try to talk to you about believing what they believe?

You state that Christians are believing something false but do you know that with 100% certainty?  I am a Christian and I keep that to myself but if asked my beliefs I will not deny them.  If we met in real life, would you have an issue with me solely on my belief (because as you state I believe in something untrue and am a potential danger to others) or would we be cool (assuming personalities aren't conflicting) unless I start telling you to believe what I do?

by all means, have your silly beliefs, talk about them and organize yourself into groups with others who share them. Please, be my guest.

Just leave the fucking kids alone.

Niemenovic, I am assuming you are referring to indoctrination.  I am a Christian, I do not go to church.  I believe the vast majority of churches and religious institutions today are akin to the Pharisees written in the Biblical times.  Arrogant, holier than though, infallible bigots.  I have 5 kids.  They ask questions and I tell them what I believe but I will never discourage them thinking for themselves.  My kids can see on my bookshelf the books of C.S. Lewis, Lee Strobel, Norman Geisler and next to them, David Hume, Immanuel Kant, Charles Darwin, Richard Dawkins.  I read them all because it absurd to listen to one view and tune out the opposing view. I look at both from an objective point of view and make my own decisions.  I don't send my kids to Bible Camp, nor do I force them to pray at night or at meals.  Maybe I'm odd and I think even other Christians will probably have an issue with my methods, but I'm not here to satisfy people.

(July 29, 2015 at 2:04 pm)SnakeOilWarrior Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 11:48 am)Godschild Wrote: No she didn't.

GC

More than you ever will.

Hey, I meant she didn't believe her friend was real, you're slow and I've taken that into account.

GC

(July 29, 2015 at 2:37 pm)TubbyTubby Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 2:27 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: Because none of us can undeniably show that anyone else is wrong on this point (even if we can present enough of a case to show you might be wrong), does not in and of itself make it wrong.

Either all of you are wrong or all of you are wrong apart from the right one. Which would you think gives better odds?

Tubby, every last one of us could be wrong and the answer could be something never even discussed.  But how does anyone prove it with certainty?  You can't.  All you can do is make an argument and come to a conclusion beyond reasonable doubt.  Like a court of law.  the jurors might not get every piece of truth or only part of the truth, but that can make a judgment based on the evidence presented and say "this is what I believe happened based on the evidence".  It might be part and parcel of what really happened but does that make the judgement any less wrong.  That's why I call myself an agnostic theist.  I cannot possible know with certainty but I can ascertain a belief based on the evidence.  Same as you

(July 29, 2015 at 2:00 pm)lkingpinl Wrote: Redbeard, I am a Christian and do not identify with any of that and I am equally disgusted by those that espouse those claims based religion.  But because I identify as a Christian do you lump me in with that camp?  Since you identify as an Atheist should I lump you in with Hitler and Stalin?  I think we can both agree that would not be fair.  I will join ranks with you to fight those that identify with all you have shown, but for different reasons.

Hitler was almost certainly not an atheist. He was most likely a Christian, in fact.
As for Stalin, I have virtually nothing in common with him. Lump me in with whoever you want, though. I'm a Pink Wizard. I basically don't care what others think.

If you don't do those things and wouldn't defend them under any circumstances, then I wasn't talking about you, was I? I was merely explaining why so many atheists fight religion so viciously. That was your question, yes? It's because religion causes many foul things, and the few good things it claims responsibility for don't even require religion. We, therefore, see it as more efficient to simply do away with religion and treat the texts as literature and fiction (at best).

(July 29, 2015 at 2:41 pm)TubbyTubby Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 2:38 pm)Godschild Wrote:  Now who's putting words in someone else mouth. I know God is real, that He exists, so you couldn't have known what I know or you couldn't ever be an atheist. You could say you've walked away from God, but you couldn't say He's not real. Can't help you have mental issues about ghosts, you might want to get that checked out. I'm none of the above, I love God and know that He will always be with me, and again your death will tell you everything about God, unless you reconsider you present belief.

Gc

You're sounding ever more desperate GC, maybe you should try the buddhist approach.

I'm not desperate, what could possibly make you think that, yes I know as usual you have no real argument, sorry I forgot.

GC

Godschild,

I'm sorry friend, but the answers that you are giving are not logically consistent. No one KNOWS that God exists. Saying you believe he exists and is real is far different from claiming to know. You are making a non falsifiable claim. It is precisely arguments like these from most theists that turn atheists away. It shows arrogance and nothing else. Also how is telling people they will see when they get to Hell constructive? If you are a true Bible believer you need to open the book back up and read some more.

(July 29, 2015 at 12:27 pm)Crossless1 Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 12:09 pm)Godschild Wrote: No one asked me to make it work, just what I know. Unlike you I know for certain that the God of the Bible exists. You could have never believed as I do or you would not have become an atheist. You're the one who's wrong and like I've told others death will reveal the truth to you.

GC

Or not.  Pascal's Wager doesn't cut it around here.  Even someone as stone dense as you should have figured that out by now.

We all know how it warms your heart to think of those who dismiss you as getting what you think they have coming to them, much as you claim otherwise.  It's ok, GC, let that inner Tertullian out.  Let him run free.  Wallow in your anticipatory schadenfreude.  Enjoy yourself.  You're not fooling anyone with your fake concern over our eternal fate; you're simply unable to conceal your gloating.  So let it out, you petulant child of Christ.

It's not like you can do much at this point to lower anyone's opinion of you.  You buried that bar a long time ago.

 I did not come here to set a standard to be liked, unlike you I do not need to kiss someone's butt, I never have and want, I'm quite assured of who and what I am. Your opinion and that's all it is, is worthless to me.

GC

(July 29, 2015 at 2:54 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(July 29, 2015 at 2:41 pm)TubbyTubby Wrote: You're sounding ever more desperate GC, maybe you should try the buddhist approach.

I'm not desperate, what could possibly make you think that, yes I know as usual you have no real argument, sorry I forgot.

GC

There is no argument to place against personal belief GC, you should have realised that by now surely?