Honestly, I'm not that up on Calvinism, but as I understand it one of the core tenets is that salvation and damnation are predetermined. Since God is supposed to be all-knowing and all-powerful, then doesn't that mean that he creates humans exactly as he sees fit, and since he's all-knowing, wouldn't that also mean that he would know exactly how every human would act? If he is both all-knowing and all-powerful, then wouldn't it be impossible for any human to have the freewill to change his fate?
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Does Calvinism make the most sense as far as Christianity Goes?
Does Calvinism make the most sense as far as Christianity Goes?
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Does Calvinism make the most sense as far as Christianity Goes?
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It's a slightly more consistent pile of bullshit in this regard, I'll give you that.....
Calvin was a dick.
Quote:There is no worse screen to block out the Spirit than confidence in our own intelligence.  RE: Does Calvinism make the most sense as far as Christianity Goes?
July 29, 2015 at 2:49 pm
(This post was last modified: July 29, 2015 at 2:50 pm by Pyrrho.)
Calvinism is certainly the result of an attempt at making Christianity make sense. It certainly fits better with many Biblical passages than some alternate versions of Christianity.
Like: There are other such verses, but the above should make the point well enough. Those Christians who do not believe in predestination do the usual hand waving nonsense to ignore what those verses say and pretend they say something else. And, as you say, predestination fits better with omnipotence and especially omniscience. So it seems more consistent than some versions of Christianity. "A wise man ... proportions his belief to the evidence." — David Hume, An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding, Section X, Part I.
Depends who you ask really, Catholics reject Calvinism under the logic that while God does know if you're going to Heaven or Hell already, it's still your choice to make. He knows what choice you are going to make already, but it's still one you make yourself.
I don't think any of it is supposed to make sense, it's supposed to overwhelm you with the "mystery" of it.
I'm overwhelmed by the stupidity of it.
 Does Calvinism make the most sense as far as Christianity Goes?
July 29, 2015 at 5:02 pm
(This post was last modified: July 29, 2015 at 5:09 pm by TubbyTubby.)
Blimey, as a confirmed ignorant to holy scripture those verses give me more confidence that I don't need that sort of shite in my life. I couldn't even begin to twist that to form any relevance to anything real if I sat down for a week.
GC and Drich I salute you. Anyone that can relate to that bunch of bollocks has way more imagination than me. 18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. 19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? Is that really stuff from the bible? I couldn't be arsed to look. Oh my fuck GC, I can see why you are so fucked up believing in this shit. What the fuck does " Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth" even mean? I know I'll regret that question. (July 29, 2015 at 5:02 pm)TubbyTubby Wrote: Blimey, as a confirmed ignorant to holy scripture those verses give me more confidence that I don't need that sort of shite in my life. I couldn't even begin to twist that to form any relevance to anything real if I sat down for a week. The more one knows about religion, the more one has to despise in it. It is from knowing about it that one realizes how incredibly vile it is. What has appeared thus far in this thread, though, is as nothing. If this stuff upsets you, you had better avoid threads in which much of the Bible is quoted, as it is a seriously messed up piece of work. In answer to your specific question, God has mercy on those He chooses to have mercy, and He hardens the hearts of those He wishes to not follow Him. Which is to say, He is kind to those people to whom it pleases God to be kind, and God makes people against God when it pleases God to make them against Him. I am sure, though, that the Christians who are antagonistic to the obvious meaning of these verses will say otherwise, if they bother to respond to your question. "A wise man ... proportions his belief to the evidence." — David Hume, An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding, Section X, Part I.
Calvin was cool but I preferred Hobbs.
 (July 29, 2015 at 2:26 pm)The Batlord Wrote: Honestly, I'm not that up on Calvinism, but as I understand it one of the core tenets is that salvation and damnation are predetermined. Since God is supposed to be all-knowing and all-powerful, then doesn't that mean that he creates humans exactly as he sees fit, and since he's all-knowing, wouldn't that also mean that he would know exactly how every human would act? If he is both all-knowing and all-powerful, then wouldn't it be impossible for any human to have the freewill to change his fate? Calvin was fucking moron who stated the young earth creation theory even though people said no he is wrong. This type of stupidity is the type of shit that holds us back.
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