(September 28, 2015 at 5:14 pm)Vicki Q Wrote: Jesus also put a lot of effort into moving Judaism into a post Torah world. (Much more than is generally realised by today's church; as modern third Quest theology explains how Jewish the whole business was, that should change.) In fact far from contradicting Paul, that passage affirms his position; the mission of Jesus is not to go against what Torah and prophets had to say, but to fulfil their purpose.

BTW, who is in your picture?

I disagree entirely that Jesus put any effort into trying to move Judaism away from the teachings of the Pentateuch.

My avatar is William Hartnell.

(September 28, 2015 at 4:06 pm)Godschild Wrote: You say He does but you've failed to prove it. The children of Israel broke the covenant, therefore they lost what they were given as God said they would.

Aractus Wrote:How can they break an unconditional covenant GC?

They were given the land, God told them what to take and they didn't, they quit on God's promise and God, from the time they left Egypt till they stop taking the lands they were suppose to. Remember God wouldn't let the generation that came out of Egypt even try and take the land, they all wondered around in the desert and died over a forty year period. The covenant was never conditional.

(September 28, 2015 at 4:06 pm)Godschild Wrote: Eggs and cheeses and milks from various animals all contain B12, these were things people could eat because it did not require the killing of animals, and since you seem to be lacking in Bible knowledge let me remind you, God created the domestic animals also, God knew what was needed, God supplies our needs.

Aractus Wrote:Eggs contain a fraction of the B12 that is found in meat - about 1/3rd or so. The amount in two eggs weighing 120g together would be 1/8th or so of what would be found in a 300g piece of meat.

But, GC, they couldn't eggs anyway because they hadn't been instructed to. They couldn't eat dairy as there were no domesticated Aurochs in ancient times, most people didn't have one of the lactate persistence genes (and even today most of the world's population doesn't) - and there is no instruction from God to eat dairy. Furthermore, milk contains only around 1/3d the amount of B12 found in Eggs - let alone found in meat!! You would need to drink 2L of milk to get the same amount of B12 in a 350g steak.

By the way domestic animals weren't created by God - he claimed to have domesticated all animals (or at least have made them all fear man) to Noah - however all domestic animals were domesticated from wild animals.

Genesis 1:24 And God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds- livestock and creeping things and beasts of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. 25) And God made the beasts of the earth according to their kinds and the livestock according to their kinds, and everything that creeps on the ground according to it's kind. And God saw that it was good.
Now tell me if God created livestock and the people were not suppose to use them for over 1700 years then why did He create them, livestock are domesticated animals.  (livestock-animals kept to be used)
!00g of beef contains up to 83ug of B12 and an adult only needs 2.5ug daily to have a healthy level of B12, so the very portions you posted for eggs and dairy would be more than enough B12 daily. So get off the B12 deal it's a dead issue now. Also you are leaving the context of scripture again, livestock is domesticated animals and created by God, they weren't evolved, I do agree some kinds of animals were domesticated from wild animals as man needed them.

(September 28, 2015 at 4:06 pm)Godschild Wrote: Know if you would show me where God said the covenant was unconditional, I'm pretty sure that word is not found in the scriptures.

Aractus Wrote:Genesis 12. There is no "unconditional" word but no conditions whatsoever are given to Abram.

Genesis 12:7 Then the LORD appeared to Abram and said, "To your offspring I will give this land." So he built there an altar to the LORD, who had appeared to him there. Your right I've provided the verse and it says, God will give them the land and He did, no what, ifs, and or buts to it, God gave them the land. That was the whole promise to Abram. God didn't say to him He wouldn't take the land from them for reasons God deemed necessary.

GC

Fails to exist, mostly.

(September 28, 2015 at 4:13 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote:

(September 28, 2015 at 4:06 pm)Godschild Wrote: He filmed these things, yet you doubt, why, to keep your delusion alive. He never got permission to remove any items from where they laid. The people of those lands do not want the Bible proven, so they do everything to deter the process, something atheist agree with, unfortunately.

GC

Really? The people of "those lands" do not want the Bible proven? REALLY, dude?

No one on this earth has more to profit by than the Israel Antiquities Authority, since the tourism that their archaeological finds generate is massive. And yet, here's what they had to say about him:

Quote:Archaeologist 

Quote:Joe Zias of Israel Antiquities Authority (IAA) has stated that "Ron Wyatt is neither an archaeologist nor has he ever carried out a legally licensed excavation in Israel or Jerusalem. In order to excavate one must have at least a BA in archaeology which he does not possess despite his claims to the contrary. ... [His claims] fall into the category of trash which one finds in tabloids such as the National Enquirer, Sun, etc."

(emphasis mine)

The areas to be searched are in Muslim controlled countries, the Muslims definitely wouldn't want the Bible to be proven correct, it's why they want give Christians access to sites that are Biblical. Wyatt has video of those chariot wheels. Does it take a degree to recognize and video chariot wheels, I don't think so. Wyatt tried to get permission from the governments of many nations but was refused because he's a Christian looking to bring evidence of Bible stories.

GC

(September 28, 2015 at 11:19 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: "ARACTUS" sounds/looks either like "erection" or "a rectum".

I like the way your mind works.  (How many Hail Marys?)

(September 28, 2015 at 4:14 pm)Redbeard The Pink Wrote:

---

(September 25, 2015 at 12:58 pm)Godschild Wrote:  This is what I believe, if any one thing is not true in the scriptures how am I to trust any other part. If the flood is false then how do I know that Christ isn't false. It has to be true from the beginning to the end, if any part is false then how do I determine what is real, or how could you. People who start reading the Bible and come to the conclusion that this part or that part isn't true, then they put doubt into the equation before they can find the truth through God, in other words a person stifles the Holy Spirit's conviction without being able to be lead to the truth. Why people do this is beyond me, it's like telling your math teacher he/she doesn't know what they are teaching simply because when the student first encounters the math they do not understand it so they reject it.
 You know I didn't say they were eating a king's meal, what I did do, was point out it was very possible for Noah and his family and the next generation or two to easily survive and not cause any extinction of any animal before the world could recover from the flood. I did this with only three animals and some vegetation, there are more possibilities to go with what I proposed, viable ones.

GC

The same way everyone else does: by doing sufficient mental gymnastics to convince yourself that nothing in "the scriptures" is untrue, even if it is demonstrably untrue because of evidence. All you have to do is dismiss and/or repurpose all evidence that is contrary to your presupposed belief. It's easy.


Furthermore, you're actually quite good at it already. Otherwise it would bother you that the animals wouldn't have had the genetic diversity to speciate. It might also bother you that the boat was floors deep, sealed with pitch, and had one window on the top deck, meaning all the animals on lower floors would have been dead within days, if not hours.


Oh, and the animals would have killed each other, and the herbivores would have had nothing to eat when they got off the boat (do not give me some bullshit about olive trees), and the carnivores would have made an entire "kind" go extinct every time they ate anything.


Oh yeah, and all the aquatic life would have died out because fresh water would be mixing with salt water (take that, Muslims), currents would be changing, water temperature would be changing...yeah, everything would die. Everything. All the humans, all the land animals, all the sea animals, all the plants and fungi, and noah and his family and his boat full of rotten meat. That shit would have killed every...living...thing.


But none of that matters because the Wholly Babble says it and your Gaud is magic, right? Right?


I'm sure you'd like to belabor the Great Fictional Flood for a while before we move on to the fact that, say, there's not even the scantest minimum of necessary archaeological evidence for any large-scale Jewish components to the Egyptian slave population ever, ever, let alone the Exodus or the wandering in the nearby desert for 40 years, but there's also that.

---

Quote:I'm sure that doesn't bother you either, right? Right?

Hey, it's a Jewish fairy tale and you gotta believe those, right?  

Titus 1:14 (CEV) = "14 Don’t pay any attention to any of those senseless Jewish stories and human commands. These are made up by people who won’t obey the truth."

(September 29, 2015 at 1:32 am)Godschild Wrote:

(September 28, 2015 at 4:13 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: Really? The people of "those lands" do not want the Bible proven? REALLY, dude?

No one on this earth has more to profit by than the Israel Antiquities Authority, since the tourism that their archaeological finds generate is massive. And yet, here's what they had to say about him:


(emphasis mine)

The areas to be searched are in Muslim controlled countries, the Muslims definitely wouldn't want the Bible to be proven correct, it's why they want give Christians access to sites that are Biblical. Wyatt has video of those chariot wheels. Does it take a degree to recognize and video chariot wheels, I don't think so. Wyatt tried to get permission from the governments of many nations but was refused because he's a Christian looking to bring evidence of Bible stories.

GC

The problem with your pet conspiracy theory is that the Muslim Qur'an is based on the Old Testament, and contains the stories of Moses, Noah, etc.

Finding those objects would be a win for them, too.

The Surah of Nuh (Book of Noah).
http://www.noblequran.com/translation/surah71.html

And the story of Moses and the Red Sea is in Surah 26:52-67.
http://www.noblequran.com/translation/surah26.html

Oh, high velocity surgical practitioner. How dare you point out logical flaws in GC's arguments.

You know he'll deny all that.

Hehe.

Except I originally screwed up my citation. I cited Surah 28, where Moses is talking to the Pharaoh, rather than 26, where the Egyptians are drowned after Moses parts the red sea with his staff. So I fixt.

The Christian god cannot do anything if he does not exist.