(November 23, 2015 at 1:45 pm)robvalue Wrote: Yes, gnostic atheism does make a claim of knowledge. But I was referring only to default (weak) atheism.

Some people either can't or won't see the difference between these two, and attack any given atheist as if they are gnostic.

yes you are right but that's an important point when their goal is to win an argument.  usually in a argument or a debate each side is making a definitive statement that contradicts the opposing, so it's important to classify it that way.

In reality those that argue the weak atheism standard are really proposing the following topic:

"There is a God vs. I'm not sure, don't really care, not concerned about it" but in their mind it's "there is a God vs there is not a God"

I actually don't find many atheists who hold to the "there is a not a God" stance.  It's usually the "I don't think so, I'm not sure or I don't care either way" types.

Atheism is a religion and not playing golf is a sport

Probably because it's easier to woo fellow believers with rhetorical circus tricks.

(November 23, 2015 at 1:19 pm)TheMonster Wrote: This has been bugging me recently. Why do theists try to call atheism a religion? It makes no sense!

Religion is defined as the belief in and worship of a super-human controlling power, and atheism is precisely not that!!

When i come across websites like this (see below), I cannot just stop and shake my head at their infallible reasoning skills!

Why do religious people want atheism to be classed as religion? In a sense are they admitting that their views are idiotic?

http://debunkingatheists.blogspot.co.uk/...igion.html
http://creation.com/atheism-a-religion

That is not exclusive to believers. Very few, but some, a handful of atheists want it classified as a religion not because they agree with it, but because they want the same legal protections religion has. I think that is a bad tactic. I think you can have laws that protect all labels and all individuals in a secular society without classifying it a religion.

And some others have literally started "atheist churches" as a way to compete with religion. I also think that is a bad tactic. Not referring to legality, just don't see it as a good idea. 

But no, "atheist" is not a religion. That is like calling "off" a TV channel. Atheists don't always agree on every topic all the time.

I believe atheist/irreligious is becoming a "protected" class, just as much as any religion. Is that right? Has it happened already? (In the US, I mean.)

(November 23, 2015 at 2:03 pm)robvalue Wrote: I believe atheist/irreligious is becoming a "protected" class, just as much as any religion. Is that right? Has it happened already? (In the US, I mean.)

In some sense yes. Atheists have begun psudeo-Churches to compete with actual churches. I am not sure if the label "atheism" is automatically linked with religion in the US legal system.

(November 23, 2015 at 2:03 pm)robvalue Wrote: I believe atheist/irreligious is becoming a "protected" class, just as much as any religion. Is that right? Has it happened already? (In the US, I mean.)

In word yes, in practice no. The First Amendment and oath of office should be enough by themselves to protect atheists. But even then, if you have no recording or documentation of discrimination, say about housing or a job, especially in "right to work states" they can fire you for anything and it would be hard to prove.

Say for example, you come out as gay, or come out as atheist, your landlord can lie and say it was about breach of contract, or if they are a real estate agent, they can simply say "this house is not for you". Or if you are on the job, and you come in with your uniform slightly out of place, but fixable on the spot, they could use that to fire you and you would never be able to prove the real reason was your label.

We are protected in the context that we are legal be it born or naturalized and especially with no criminal record. But humans lie about everything and their are very easy ways to avoid getting caught when you are a bigot. But that isn't just about atheists, that is about any minority label.

I believe it is getting/already has protection as if it was a religion, but is not referred to as a religion itself. That's the last I heard from the Atheist Experience a while ago.

Brian: Thanks, right yeah. That just sucks.

There are idiot theists who simply cannot fathom that a person cannot exist without "believing" in something.  They try to remake atheists in their image the same way they have created god in their image.

Fuck 'em.

Theists classify Atheism as a religion to group everyone together. It's kind of fucking funny cause when you do it to them they go "NOT ALL CHRISTIANS BELIEVE THAT!", but when someone tries to explain that not all atheists believe in the same thing they can go "ATHEISTS BELIEVE THIS!"