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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:29 pm
According to the story, the church was founded by Jesus, but started right off the bat with Peter at the helm.
Catholics follow the teachings of those who are in tune with Jesus (or claim to be), the popes.
They "correctly" interpret the scriptures and their own "interactions" with the divine, and provide the faithful with all the guidance they need.
The bible is a nice book, with nice stories, but they need not be the full truth. And thus need not be followed to the letter.
The guidance provided by the popes, however, should be in line with the teachings of Jesus, for he was the one who imbued them with that proximity to the divine...and those teachings have been preserved in the NT.
The OT is there to provide some support to the NT and some legitimacy to Jesus... the bits of the OT that don't align with these goals can be safely ignored as teachings or rulings of old times... no longer heeded by civilized people.
Let me know if I got anything wrong, CL, 
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:34 pm
(February 28, 2016 at 2:29 pm)pocaracas Wrote: According to the story, the church was founded by Jesus, but started right off the bat with Peter at the helm.
Catholics follow the teachings of those who are in tune with Jesus (or claim to be), the popes.
They "correctly" interpret the scriptures and their own "interactions" with the divine, and provide the faithful with all the guidance they need.
The bible is a nice book, with nice stories, but they need not be the full truth. And thus need not be followed to the letter.
The guidance provided by the popes, however, should be in line with the teachings of Jesus, for he was the one who imbued them with that proximity to the divine...and those teachings have been preserved in the NT.
The OT is there to provide some support to the NT and some legitimacy to Jesus... the bits of the OT that don't align with these goals can be safely ignored as teachings or rulings of old times... no longer heeded by civilized people.
Let me know if I got anything wrong, CL,
Thank you, Poca. I'm not very good at explaining things. 
This is all correct. Peter was the first pope of the church which we believe God Himself (as Jesus) founded, and has a divine connection to.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:34 pm
(This post was last modified: February 28, 2016 at 2:36 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
...and yet the vicarious redemption of a hereditary sin-debt incurred by non-existent "first parents", demanded to be accepted as no less than literal, -is- heeded by "civilized people". 
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:45 pm
(February 28, 2016 at 2:34 pm)Rhythm Wrote: ...and yet the vicarious redemption of a hereditary sin-debt incurred by non-existent "first parents", demanded to be accepted as no less than literal, -is- heeded by "civilized people".
yes... but does it matter?
(supposing that intellectual honesty is not valued too much)
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:48 pm
Ah yes, fantasy lore. Ol' Saint Pete is on a mood lately. hail and shit.
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:51 pm
(February 28, 2016 at 2:48 pm)LastPoet Wrote: Ah yes, fantasy lore. Ol' Saint Pete is on a mood lately. hail and shit.
That was on Friday...
Today, I got sunshine and blue skies!
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:54 pm
(This post was last modified: February 28, 2016 at 2:58 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(February 28, 2016 at 2:45 pm)pocaracas Wrote: (February 28, 2016 at 2:34 pm)Rhythm Wrote: ...and yet the vicarious redemption of a hereditary sin-debt incurred by non-existent "first parents", demanded to be accepted as no less than literal, -is- heeded by "civilized people".
yes... but does it matter?
(supposing that intellectual honesty is not valued too much)
Absolutely, yes.
People who think it's okay, and even divine, to string up the better man for their own misdeeds have greater issues than the intellectual honesty of their positions. To hold up an example of base immorality as the greatest possible expression of love and goodness, in order to fulfill a blood debt that never was, is the kind of thing that forms the context of our moral landscapes...and it's more disturbing if they really -do- believe it, rather than pay it lip service. If that's something that a "good person" or a "civil person" is so much as okay with, let alone reverent in regards to......goodness and civility don't count for much.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:54 pm
(February 28, 2016 at 2:34 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Thank you, Poca. I'm not very good at explaining things.
This is all correct. Peter was the first pope of the church which we believe God Himself (as Jesus) founded, and has a divine connection to.
Cheers!
It is sometimes strange to see how the folks around here pick on catholicism without understanding that it's not a form of christianity that follows the bible as best they can.
There's a difference, compared to the "protestant" and similar versions of christianity... and it's an important difference, albeit one that even you seemed to find difficult to account for. 
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:58 pm
(February 28, 2016 at 2:54 pm)Rhythm Wrote: (February 28, 2016 at 2:45 pm)pocaracas Wrote: yes... but does it matter?
(supposing that intellectual honesty is not valued too much)
Absolutely, yes.
People who think it's okay, and even divine, to string up the better man for their own misdeeds have greater issues than the intellectual honesty of their positions. To hold up an example of base immorality as the greatest possible expression of love and goodness, in order to fulfill a blood debt that never was, is the kind of thing that forms the context of our moral landscapes...and it's more disturbing if they really -do- believe it, rather than pay it lip service.
yeah... but they're conditioned to not think about like that.
"He died for our sins" (whatever that means....)
"He showed the ultimate expression of love"
"we should aspire to be as he was"
Sounds so much better than what you said.... while being the exact same thing
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RE: My views on objective morality
February 28, 2016 at 2:59 pm
(February 28, 2016 at 2:51 pm)pocaracas Wrote: That was on Friday...
Today, I got sunshine and blue skies!
And yesterday. Perspective is brought to our lives when for some reason you use your saturday to haul lumber to one's uncle bakery just for... reasons. I think hail bouncing off one's shoulders brings some peace into mind. Or some shit like that.
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