Thanks, Mister Agenda and Ben Davies. I started to reply to this diatribe yesterday, but refrained from posting since I was that enraged by that simplistic 50/50, black and white comment and the breastpounding bit that I had second thoughts about it.

(March 25, 2016 at 1:33 am)scoobysnack Wrote: This is such a strange thing, but I've noticed over the years that liberals and atheists prefer Islam over Christianity. We have terms such as Islamaphobe for example. Where I live in Madison, the freedom for religion foundation doesn't ever go after Islam, but goes after Christianity. Doesn't really go after Judaism either for that matter. Why do the left and the atheists support Islam? Do they support the stoning of women who commit adultery, or throwing gay people off roofs? Do they prefer women have their clitorises cut off for female mutilation? Do they want to walk around in a halloween costumes or bee keeper suits known as burkas? What's up with the left/atheist love Islam? I can understand the left at least because they are all about privilege, but for atheists, that's another story I'd like hear about.

I hate Islam. I don't hate Muslims.

As far as I'm concerned, overall, Islam is currently the most dangerous religion, on a world wide level. But in the US, Christianity is more dangerous. 

The reason why the FFRF does not go after Islam, is that Muslims have almost no power base in the US. Christians do. 

As much as some Muslims my vocalise that they want Sharia law, it will never happen in the US, en masse. 

But Christianity, with their constant attempts at having religious based pseudoscience taught in public school science classes, attempts to curtail some people's civil rights, and generally try to inflict their Biblical "morality", has more immediate effects on US society. 

If women were being stoned for adultery, or gay people were being thrown off roofs in the US, the perpetrators would be prosecuted for murder. 

Do you want me to start listing the names of gay people that have been murdered by Christians?

(March 25, 2016 at 2:01 am)scoobysnack Wrote:

(March 25, 2016 at 1:54 am)Minimalist Wrote: Actually, all religions suck cock, son.

Well some religions apparently have priveledge then.

Feel free to contact the http://ffrf.org/ to start going against Islam. I think they are actually scared of a terrorist attack against them, which is a major reason everyone is scared of the "religion of peace".

Maybe you are not quit aware of what the FFRF does. They are a national organization, not an international one. 

Their main purpose is to protect separation of church and state, and to protect the Constitutional rights of non-theists.

The only religious group in the US with the power to inflict their unConstitutional, religion based laws on the US are Christians.

(March 30, 2016 at 9:21 pm)Simon Moon Wrote:

(March 25, 2016 at 2:01 am)scoobysnack Wrote: Well some religions apparently have priveledge then.

Feel free to contact the http://ffrf.org/ to start going against Islam. I think they are actually scared of a terrorist attack against them, which is a major reason everyone is scared of the "religion of peace".

Maybe you are not quit aware of what the FFRF does. They are a national organization, not an international one. 

Their main purpose is to protect separation of church and state, and to protect the Constitutional rights of non-theists.

The only religious group in the US with the power to inflict their unConstitutional, religion based laws on the US are Christians.

They don't seem to care about preserving rights of Christians that much though. Yes though I don't follow them that much, although they are located in my city, Madison WI. What about the Jews for example? I don't see atheist targeting Jews all that much. Not that I want to start the thread in that direction, and maybe it's from my limited experience but seems to be more directed at Christians. For example, I read the opinion pieces in the newspaper from the heads of the FFRF on Christian holidays talking about the need to get away from them, but don't seem to see them talking about Islam or Judaism in that context. Not that I follow FFRF that closely at all, so I'm sure there are instances.

Do you think a child should be able to bring a bible, torah, or koran to public school to read, even if they are not sharing it with others? Do you think Christians should be allowed to give out Christmas cards to their friends at school? What about Jehovahs witnesses who don't celebrate holidays, or even birthdays? Should we accommodate their beliefs and not mention birthdays in the workplace? We had to stop having holiday and birthday celebrations at work to accommodate one Jehovah's witness in my dept to make it inclusive. Instead we had random parties. Do you as an atheist get upset during holidays?

(March 29, 2016 at 1:12 pm)Amine Wrote: 4. It's exotic. Christianity is boring and routine, but few people have ever really met Muslims. It is mysterious.

Speak for yourself, asshole. Some of us have ventured beyond the county line.

(March 30, 2016 at 9:39 pm)scoobysnack Wrote: Do you as an atheist get upset during holidays?

Tell you what. I don't give half a shit what anyone chooses to celebrate.

(March 25, 2016 at 5:32 pm)The Atheist Wrote: I'm a proud Islamaphobe. I'm also a proud Naziphobe and a proud communistphobe.

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(March 25, 2016 at 4:58 pm)Cecelia Wrote: Atheists nor liberals like Islam.  But everyone has a right to believe what they want, without being you know... ACTUALLY persecuted.  Christians in this country wouldn't know what persecution looked like if it bit them in the ass.  It's a bit funny how the folks who LOVE religious liberty LOVE denying it to others.

A couple of muslims commit terrible acts, and everyone goes crazy and suggests banning muslims.
A couple of Christians do the same thing, and the silence is deafening. Except for the part where they use the No True Scotsman defense.  

Tell me when a Presidential Candidate says "We should ban Christians from coming into this country", and doesn't get destroyed by the media.

Islam is a lot worse than Christianity.

Oh, I don't know about that.  Both Islam and Christianity, given the same latitude, are downright evil.  However, Christianity is strongest in the west where our primarily secular culture has largely neutered its negative impulses.  In the east where Islam is strongest, that hasn't happened.  But don't let  that fool you, Muslims in the west are also similarly neutered and just as "peaceful" as the Christians, and Christians, outside of the secular influence, are just as sick and sadistic as the Muslims.  Go look at Christian behavior in places like Africa, they're a downright evil lot.

All religion sucks.  All religion is dangerous unless secular society puts a muzzle on it.  And even then, it's only safe so long as we all keep a close eye on it.  Otherwise, it can break free and cause untold harm.

scoobysnack Wrote:

Simon Moon Wrote:Maybe you are not quit aware of what the FFRF does. They are a national organization, not an international one. 

Their main purpose is to protect separation of church and state, and to protect the Constitutional rights of non-theists.

The only religious group in the US with the power to inflict their unConstitutional, religion based laws on the US are Christians.

They don't seem to care about preserving rights of Christians that much though. Yes though I don't follow them that much, although they are located in my city, Madison WI. What about the Jews for example? I don't see atheist targeting Jews all that much. Not that I want to start the thread in that direction, and maybe it's from my limited experience but seems to be more directed at Christians. For example, I read the opinion pieces in the newspaper from the heads of the FFRF on Christian holidays talking about the need to get away from them, but don't seem to see them talking about Islam or Judaism in that context. Not that I follow FFRF that closely at all, so I'm sure there are instances.

Do you think a child should be able to bring a bible, torah, or koran to public school to read, even if they are not sharing it with others? Do you think Christians should be allowed to give out Christmas cards to their friends at school? What about Jehovahs witnesses who don't celebrate holidays, or even birthdays? Should we accommodate their beliefs and not mention birthdays in the workplace? We had to stop having holiday and birthday celebrations at work to accommodate one Jehovah's witness in my dept to make it inclusive. Instead we had random parties. Do you as an atheist get upset during holidays?

Although preserving the rights of Christians isn't in the FFRF's charter, anymore than it's in the NAACP's; I'd be interested in learning what rights Christians have lost in the USA. As far as I can tell, they've only had some of their special privileges diminished.

What have the Jews done in the USA to violate separation of religion and government that the FFRF should be addressing? No Jewish holiday is also a federal holiday. The FFRF is about preserving separation of religion and government, they don't care what holidays you celebrate as long as you're not involving the government in them.

Children should be able to and are able to bring their religious texts to school to read; provided they don't do it in such a way that it is disruptive. Students should be able to and are able to give whatever kind of cards they want to at school that aren't otherwise in violation of school policy (regarding language or whatever). It's a different matter for teachers who are government paid authority figures with a captive audience of other people's children.

JWs don't have to be protected from hearing about birthdays in the workplace, unless it's done with an intent to harass them. However, a business may choose to be sensitive to their situation.

Holidays don't upset me in the slightest, though the annual 'War on Christmas' coverage amuses me. I hear now it's started up on Easter (some chocolate company sold chocolate bunnies without putting 'Easter' on the box).

(March 30, 2016 at 8:02 pm)Ben Davis Wrote: I'm in bad moods when I read this thread so I take comments personally.
Agenda was too nice to you. I'm not going to be.
I've got some pent up aggression that I've got to get out of me.
I'm Kirito! Amine, I'll go SAO on your fallacy.

...and back to prose.

Firstly, which one are you? A lack of clarity is the sure sign of a disorganised mind.
B: The fact that you consider social justice to be a pejorative statement is a clear indication of your ignorance and lack of cognitive talent.
iii. Your false dichotomy is so obviously and fractally flawed, I'm amazed that you would even post something like that publically. Have you no shame?
4. How dare you misrepresent me in such a way. You incorrectly assume you know my position when you clearly haven't thought this through in anything more than the most overly simplistic, one-dimensional way.

That's right, we're all argumentative pricks who just want to shit on everyone else's day. You petty fuck-wit.

Were your parents unkind to you? It's just, I'm sensing some bitterness...

Yes, everyone but you is a one dimensional thinker with nothing but selfish motivations. You poor thing, it must be so hard having to go through life with everyone else being wrong.

Don't be so ridiculous. It may be true for you that you know few muslims but that doesn't necessarily extend across broader populations. To make such a crass generalisation pretty much excludes you from any intelligent conversation on this matter.

In summary, you don't even know me yet you've called me (and pretty much every other liberal-minded atheist on the board) hypocritical, malicious, stupid, ignorant, condescending, an uncritical thinker, petty, selfish, narcissistic, vapid and naive. Is this how you always talk to people because it makes you seem like a fucking arsehole.

Fuck you and I'll add you to the list of fools who owe me apologies.

And yeah, Scooby, I've not forgotten about you either!

So glad I could help put you in a worse mood. Turns out you're funny when you're upset.

WTF is Kirito, some anime shit? That explains a lot lol. You're going to go SAO on me? Is that more anime stuff? Shit!!! He's going to go SAO on me!!!!!!!!!!!

Organized enough for you to understand apparently. Works for me.

SJWs suck. Social justice has turned into a pejorative. Liberated of all its connotations, I guess it is fine, although who knows what it would really mean without them. Social justice by itself could mean different things to different people. But in the way everyone means it, I think it sucks. Just a way for people to cry and invent problems that aren't there like "microaggressions".

My false dichotomy? Eh, it's a bit of a generalization yes, but you've certainly fallen right into it.

Misrepresent you? Did I even quote you? I have no idea who you are.

"Not all of us are argumentative pricks, you fuckwit" - nice.

Were my parents unkind to me? They were fine.

Well I don't think everyone is wrong, remember, just the ones like you who cuck out over Islam and whatever else. Also I have shown at least 4 dimensions to my thinking about that subject!

Muslims are a tiny fraction of the population. Most people have met a few, but that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about what it would be like if there were as many Muslims as Christians. Some atheists are totally comfortable posting the most crass possible stuff about Christianity, yet when it is Islam that is criticized suddenly they are all offended and crying about bigotry. I think that is because they have no idea what it would be like if Islam dominated the culture, so they can continue to think it is harmless in their minds.

Not liberal-minded atheists--regressive minded atheists. And to that, I would agree with "hypocritical, malicious, stupid, ignorant, condescending, an uncritical thinker, petty, selfish, narcissistic, vapid and naive." Nice list, couldn't have said it better myself. Do I always talk like this to people? Here, probably. IRL, I just stay away from people like that and let them have their circle jerk.

I'm sorry you're so confused.

(March 30, 2016 at 10:21 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Speak for yourself, asshole.  Some of us have ventured beyond the county line.

I'm not talking about meeting a few Muslims. I'm talking about living in a culture where Islam is dominant. That's when it can cease to have any exotic appeal. You'd hate it. Think Christianity is bad? How about you venture beyond the county line and fuck off to Pakistan where you can live among adherents of the religion of peace.

(March 31, 2016 at 12:33 pm)Amine Wrote:

Thumpalumpacus ='1459390888' Wrote: Speak for yourself, asshole.  Some of us have ventured beyond the county line.

I'm not talking about meeting a few Muslims. I'm talking about living in a culture where Islam is dominant. That's when it can cease to have any exotic appeal. You'd hate it. Think Christianity is bad? How about you venture beyond the county line and fuck off to Pakistan where you can live among adherents of the religion of peace.

I lived in Iran for four years and Saudi Arabia for most of one. Pretty sure I've got the background to make informed comments on the matter. And I found the people there to be great, in both countries. SA's governance, of course, is shitty, but under the shah's regime in Iran, the law was secular and the people held many of our values.

How about you? What experiences in Muslim countries informs your opinion?