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#1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:24 pm
(This post was last modified: May 18, 2016 at 1:29 pm by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
This is the classic ' The Trolley Problem ':
Quote:Imagine that you’re at the controls of a railway switch and there’s an out-of-control trolley coming. The tracks branch into two, one track that leads to a group of five people, and the other to one person. If you do nothing, the trolley will smash into the five people. But if you flip the switch, it’ll change tracks and strike the lone person. What do you do?
It's a rather interesting thought experiment that let's us explore the complexity of our morality system. This was first introduced by a Moral philosopher called Philippa Foot.
Although the classic version is interesting,there are other variations that are as much as or more interesting than the classic problem.
An interesting and much more fun variation of the classic problem is:
Quote:A second variation of the problem involves a “fat man” and no second track — a man so large that, if you were to push him onto the tracks, his body would prevent the trolley from smashing into the group of five. So what do you do? Nothing? Or push him onto the tracks?
What would you do?
1) Push the fat man onto the tracks.
2) Choose to do nothing.
It's going to interesting how heathens with no objective morality would handle this problem,have at it!
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:27 pm
Trip the switch as the car is passing over it so it derails there and doesn't kill anyone at all.
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:29 pm
I'll save the five people.
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:32 pm
(This post was last modified: May 18, 2016 at 1:41 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(May 18, 2016 at 1:24 pm)pool the great Wrote: Imagine that you’re at the controls of a railway switch and there’s an out-of-control trolley coming. The tracks branch into two, one track that leads to a group of five people, and the other to one person. If you do nothing, the trolley will smash into the five people. But if you flip the switch, it’ll change tracks and strike the lone person. What do you do? -Flip the switch and cream the poor bastard who felt like being an individual that particular day.
Quote:A second variation of the problem involves a “fat man” and no second track — a man so large that, if you were to push him onto the tracks, his body would prevent the trolley from smashing into the group of five. So what do you do? Nothing? Or push him onto the tracks?
-I'd tell him to kiss his giant ass goodbye..though, I'd wonder how I could push a guy so massive that a trolley couldn't....... 
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:34 pm
It is interesting.
You effectively have two options, it's just that one is the "default". I don't personally see how it alters the morality of the situation whatever the default is.
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:36 pm
Call Spider-Man.
Shoot the driver. Dead man's switch stops the trolley. The only way to stop a trolley is a good man with a gun. (I may regret this sarcasm)
Being told you're delusional does not necessarily mean you're mental.
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:52 pm
(This post was last modified: May 18, 2016 at 1:52 pm by Athene.)
My answer in regards to the "Trolley Dilemma" has always remained the same; I would choose to do nothing.
I find it much more difficult to grapple with the idea of having a direct hand in an innocent person's death, than coping with the deaths of others through my 'inaction'.
Come to whatever conclusion you like about my morality.
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 1:57 pm
(This post was last modified: May 18, 2016 at 1:58 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
I don't think it says anything negative about your morality. Consider the effect of having a species made up, entirely, of gung ho switch-throwers. They're going to misread the situation enough times to counteract whatever good they might have intended. Some may die because of one gropups inactivity, sure..but will it be larger than the number of people offed by dumbasses who think they have a clue? Seems to me that the latter account for more deaths than the former.
We -need- you to balance out the weight of our hasty decisions! 
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 2:30 pm
The situation seems pretty clear to me, it's a thought experiment and doesn't allow for any other conditions than those mentioned, so you couldn't "fuck it up" by always flipping the switch. The only reasonable thing to do is to save the five people, not be a coward and pretend like you wouldn't be killing them if you didn't do anything. And I'm not calling Thena a coward, I'm just answering the question in the OP, but I will admit I read the other replies first and it influenced my own.
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RE: #1 Thought experiment - "The Trolley Problem"
May 18, 2016 at 2:35 pm
(May 18, 2016 at 1:52 pm)Thena323 Wrote: My answer in regards to the "Trolley Dilemma" has always remained the same; I would choose to do nothing.
I find it much more difficult to grapple with the idea of having a direct hand in an innocent person's death, than coping with the deaths of others through my 'inaction'.
Come to whatever conclusion you like about my morality.
In the TV show, Law & Order, it is noted in a couple of their episodes in some locales but not all, 'depraved indifference' is a punishable offense. As for the trolley example, Idunno.
L&O does tend to illuminate fine points of law, but even watching the show doesn't imbue this viewer with knowledge of what's best to do in a situation.
I was unaware of my own passivity in the early years of the AIDS crisis being something I would later find odious, but it did happen, and it happened after I read of Bill Kraus and his efforts early on, and unfortunately, even his early reaction wasn't enough to save himself. Would my sum of 40 friends and acquaintances lost to HIV be any different if I had been more like Kraus and less like myself ??
Idunno, but I do know it would be easier living with it if I had.
The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it.
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