(June 1, 2016 at 2:15 am)SteelCurtain Wrote:

(May 31, 2016 at 10:40 pm)Clueless Morgan Wrote: When?  Where?  I'm not saying you're not citing something true, I just don't remember this and am interested in looking it up.

ASOIAF Wiki Wrote:Tyrion recalls a memory whilst he was at Winterfell, in which he overheard Joffrey Baratheon jesting with The Hound to send a dog to kill a wolf. He guesses that Joffrey hired the catspaw among those that joined the king's party as they made their way North and that he had found the dagger amongst his father's weapons and had simply taken it. However, Tyrion is unable to figure out why Joffrey wanted Bran dead, and attributes it to his innate cruelty.[2]

Jaime later realises that Joffrey sent the assassin in an attempt to impress his father, after overhearing a drunken Robert Baratheon say it would be kinder to put the crippled Bran Stark out of his misery.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Cat...7D.7D.7D-1

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ASOS -Chapter 60 Wrote:Tyrion puzzles out how his nephew must have found Littlefinger’s Valyrian dagger amongst Robert’s possessions, assuming that the king had probably forgotten he even owned it. Joffrey must then have paid some unsavory freerider to open Bran’s throat, though Tyrion still cannot figure out why, attributing it to Joffrey's innate cruelty for the moment.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/A_S...Chapter_60

ASOS - Chapter 72 Wrote:When Cersei mentions that Robert himself, at Winterfell, said it would be kinder to put the boy out of his misery while alone with her and their children, Jaime figures out that it was Joffrey, 'desperate for a pat on the head from that sot', who sent the assassin to kill Bran, even though Cersei does not believe him when he tells her his suspicions, just as Jaime does not believe her when Cersei insists again that Tyrion is responsible for Joffrey's death.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/A_S...Chapter_72

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From the books perspective, Jaime and Cersei have no reason to be lying to each other over this.

Thanks

I still say Joffery being behind it makes no sense.

Also, wasn't Tyrion that one whose knife it was? or was that just a show thing?

Dunk and Egg is dope as hell. I recently picked up the compilation of those short stories with the hand drawn artwork. Very cool.

(June 1, 2016 at 10:42 am)Clueless Morgan Wrote: Also, wasn't Tyrion that one whose knife it was? or was that just a show thing?

That's my recollection of it from the first book, too...

(June 1, 2016 at 11:00 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(June 1, 2016 at 10:42 am)Clueless Morgan Wrote: Also, wasn't Tyrion that one whose knife it was? or was that just a show thing?

That's my recollection of it from the first book, too...

If I recall correctly, Littlefinger in the book did tell Catelyn that the dagger belonged to Tyrion, but in reality it was just one of the many weapons that Robert Baratheon hauled around with him.  It was in his royal carriage on the way up to Winterfell, so Littlefinger blaming it on Tyrion did seem reasonable to Catelyn time and place-wise.

When I read the books, I figured Littlefinger was actually behind it. Why, I don't know. His motivations are often obscured from the readers and watchers alike.
Martin must have left it intentionally open.

I gotta agree that Cercei was not behind it. We do get too much of her thoughts in the books, and this is never one of them. Jaime is more possible, as he does take some actions without consulting others. It's kind of his thing. But he also never thinks about it. Still, unlike Cercie, we don't see him brooding on related topics often. SO it could be that he just put it out of his mind as inconsequential, though considering it failed, I'd think he would think about it now and again.

So my theory is Littlefinger did it to provoke something that benefitted him.

(May 31, 2016 at 10:40 pm)Clueless Morgan Wrote: [...]Notice one thing about Joffrey pre-ascension: He was definitely a spoiled little sadistic psychopath, as you point out, but he was also a bit of a wimp who hadn't been entirely let loose to run with his power-tripping ego after he became king and no one could stop him.  He was on a long leash, but he was still on a leash, and Robert was on the other end of it. [...]

Which is why he tried to be sneaky about it.

(May 31, 2016 at 10:40 pm)Clueless Morgan Wrote: (2) Cersei isn't entirely stupid.  She's cunning in her own shortsighted way, but I would believe that she is entirely capable of bidding her time until the right moment to frame Tyrion for something he didn't do and get him executed *cough*poinsingJoffrey*cough* if she was, in fact, behind the attack on Bran.  Also, 30+ years of stewing over her hatred until the moment comes where she can do something about it?

You'd think in 30 years, she'd come up with a better plan, than a hastily thrown-together assassination, with the only evidence, that could lead to Tyrion, being a weapon, ownership of which is uncertain. This is such a feeble intrigue, that it's not entirely clear if the person, who sent the assassin even meant to incriminate Tyrion. And let's not forget, that if the direwolf didn't rip out the guy's throat - he would have been caught and "questioned", revealing his employer. A lot to bet on luck - after 30 years, of biding one's time...

(May 31, 2016 at 10:40 pm)Clueless Morgan Wrote:  Way more believable to me than Joffrey committing an act of "mercy" by having Bran killed.

Yeah, well - I'm going to have to disagree with you on that, for all the reasons I outlined in my previous few posts.

Yeah it's pretty well accepted that Joffrey was behind the catspaw's assassination attempt on Bran. He overheard his father the king (drunkenly) stating clearly that it would be a mercy for Bran to have his throat cut and that he would rather die than live as a cripple. Joffrey didn't do it out of mercy, he just wanted to impress his 'dad'.

(June 1, 2016 at 2:42 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Yeah it's pretty well accepted that Joffrey was behind the catspaw's assassination attempt on Bran.  He overheard his father the king (drunkenly) stating clearly that it would be a mercy for Bran to have his throat cut and that he would rather die than live as a cripple.  Joffrey didn't do it out of mercy, he just wanted to impress his 'dad'.

That's true.  It is pretty clear that Joffrey was responsible for the actual attempt, no what i think back.  I sometimes forget the book details, and I just don't want to reread them again.  IT's been a few years. Did he intend to frame Tyrion, or did Littlefinger intend to?  Who knows.

(June 1, 2016 at 3:11 pm)Aroura Wrote:

(June 1, 2016 at 2:42 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Yeah it's pretty well accepted that Joffrey was behind the catspaw's assassination attempt on Bran.  He overheard his father the king (drunkenly) stating clearly that it would be a mercy for Bran to have his throat cut and that he would rather die than live as a cripple.  Joffrey didn't do it out of mercy, he just wanted to impress his 'dad'.

That's true.  It is pretty clear that Joffrey was responsible for the actual attempt, no what i think back.  I sometimes forget the book details, and I just don't want to reread them again.  IT's been a few years. Did he intend to frame Tyrion, or did Littlefinger intend to?  Who knows.

I really think it was simply a misguided attempt by an incest-addled kid to impress his neglectful, alcoholic father.

(June 1, 2016 at 1:34 pm)Aroura Wrote: When I read the books, I figured Littlefinger was actually behind it.  Why, I don't know.  His motivations are often obscured from the readers and watchers alike.
Martin must have left it intentionally open.

I gotta agree that Cercei was not behind it.  We do get too much of her thoughts in the books, and this is never one of them.  Jaime is more possible, as he does take some actions without consulting others.  It's kind of his thing. But he also never thinks about it.  Still, unlike Cercie, we don't see him brooding on related topics often. SO it could be that he just put it out of his mind as inconsequential, though considering it failed, I'd think he would think about it now and again.

So my theory is Littlefinger did it to provoke something that benefitted him.

There was nothing to gain from killing Bran. Whoever did it did it for personal reasons, and Littlefinger isn't the type of guy to do that. Joff on the other hand definitely is