These puns are real kraut-pleasers!

(September 16, 2016 at 8:42 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote: Porn is great. Mostly I don't really use it when I don't have a girlfriend though. If I'm seeing someone, I don't really bother with porn. Also those studies are always worded a certain way to try to make porn seem like it's having more of an affect then it is. There has never been a study that shows that porn has any significant effect on sexual assault. However the language in the anti-porn articles always attempts to imply that, like with this bit you quoted:

Quote: an overall significant positive association between pornography use and attitudes supporting violence against women.

They are trying to imply there is a link between porn and violence towards women. However there is none. The reality is that porn is healthy and normal for both sexes. Most women that I've dated or have been close enough friends with to talk about such things, watch and masturbate to porn. What do they even mean by attitudes supporting violence towards women? If there is not actual increase in violence towards women (as there isn't) then it's a totally meaningless statement. Obviously whatever those attitudes (they certainly aren't clear in that article) they don't actually increase violence against women, otherwise the headline would be 'porn increases violence against women.'

The only thing of significance is that college age women are less sexually satisfied if their partner watches porn. That's a dubious stat at best, since it relies on hearsay but probably true, not because of the porn in and of itself but rather because simply because the man's sexual energy is going somewhere else other then his partner.

Also it's good to have you back.

That's good that you normally don't use porn while you have a girlfriend. 

I know there's been women here who have said their husbands look at it and they don't care, but it's very different for me. I would feel devastated and betrayed if my husband had any sort of porn habit. It would make me feel inadequate and like a violation of something sacred and special that is supposed to be shared exclusively between us. But then again, that comes with the territory of having very different views of sexuality.

(September 19, 2016 at 6:32 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(September 16, 2016 at 8:42 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote: Porn is great. Mostly I don't really use it when I don't have a girlfriend though. If I'm seeing someone, I don't really bother with porn. Also those studies are always worded a certain way to try to make porn seem like it's having more of an affect then it is. There has never been a study that shows that porn has any significant effect on sexual assault. However the language in the anti-porn articles always attempts to imply that, like with this bit you quoted:

They are trying to imply there is a link between porn and violence towards women. However there is none. The reality is that porn is healthy and normal for both sexes. Most women that I've dated or have been close enough friends with to talk about such things, watch and masturbate to porn. What do they even mean by attitudes supporting violence towards women? If there is not actual increase in violence towards women (as there isn't) then it's a totally meaningless statement. Obviously whatever those attitudes (they certainly aren't clear in that article) they don't actually increase violence against women, otherwise the headline would be 'porn increases violence against women.'

The only thing of significance is that college age women are less sexually satisfied if their partner watches porn. That's a dubious stat at best, since it relies on hearsay but probably true, not because of the porn in and of itself but rather because simply because the man's sexual energy is going somewhere else other then his partner.

Also it's good to have you back.

That's good that you normally don't use porn while you have a girlfriend. 

I know there's been women here who have said their husbands look at it and they don't care, but it's very different for me. I would feel devastated and betrayed if my husband had any sort of porn habit. It would make me feel inadequate and like a violation of something sacred and special that is supposed to be shared exclusively between us. But then again, that comes with the territory of having very different views of sexuality.

Catholic_Lady, if this is too personal just ignore this, but I am interested in this sense that you would feel betrayed if your partner watched porn.

From whence would you say this feeling originates? Is it a sense that he would be committing adultery by directing any form of sexual response to other women, or is it more an impassive sense of distaste through failing to uphold the moral code of your faith that I presume he either believes in or is expected to adhere to? Perhaps it has nothing to do with faith at all and you just aren't comfortable with the idea of him finding sexual stimulation, however indirectly from someone else, I'm curious.

As for the original topic...I wouldn't be thrilled by a partner watching porn after that level of intimacy had formed. I admit my own thoughts would drift towards "Am I really that shit in bed/ugly/uncreative enough they've got to `get it' elsewhere?" but I'd probably never mention it to them, since I'd personally scribe that up to my own personal insecurity rather than them actually doing something objectively bad.

(September 19, 2016 at 6:32 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(September 16, 2016 at 8:42 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote: Porn is great. Mostly I don't really use it when I don't have a girlfriend though. If I'm seeing someone, I don't really bother with porn. Also those studies are always worded a certain way to try to make porn seem like it's having more of an affect then it is. There has never been a study that shows that porn has any significant effect on sexual assault. However the language in the anti-porn articles always attempts to imply that, like with this bit you quoted:

They are trying to imply there is a link between porn and violence towards women. However there is none. The reality is that porn is healthy and normal for both sexes. Most women that I've dated or have been close enough friends with to talk about such things, watch and masturbate to porn. What do they even mean by attitudes supporting violence towards women? If there is not actual increase in violence towards women (as there isn't) then it's a totally meaningless statement. Obviously whatever those attitudes (they certainly aren't clear in that article) they don't actually increase violence against women, otherwise the headline would be 'porn increases violence against women.'

The only thing of significance is that college age women are less sexually satisfied if their partner watches porn. That's a dubious stat at best, since it relies on hearsay but probably true, not because of the porn in and of itself but rather because simply because the man's sexual energy is going somewhere else other then his partner.

Also it's good to have you back.

That's good that you normally don't use porn while you have a girlfriend. 

I know there's been women here who have said their husbands look at it and they don't care, but it's very different for me. I would feel devastated and betrayed if my husband had any sort of porn habit. It would make me feel inadequate and like a violation of something sacred and special that is supposed to be shared exclusively between us. But then again, that comes with the territory of having very different views of sexuality.

My son's mother and I would sometimes watch porn together -- getting ideas, working up a lather, that sort of thing. With a good woman, looking at it out of need, and more importantly keeping it secret from her, is a bit of betrayal, I think.

(September 19, 2016 at 7:07 pm)SenpaiNoticeMeYouBlindShmuck Wrote: I
From whence would you say this feeling originates? Is it a sense that he would be committing adultery by directing any form of sexual response to other women, or is it more an impassive sense of distaste through failing to admit my own thoughts would drift towards "Am I really that shit in bed/ugly/uncreative enough they've got to `get it' elsewhere?" but I'd probably never mention it to them, since I'd personally scribe that up to my own personal insecurity rather than them actually doing something objectively bad.

Wouldn't a sensitive partner be aware of those insecurities you speak of?

(September 19, 2016 at 7:42 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: Wouldn't a sensitive partner be aware of those insecurities you speak of?

Ehhhhhh......

I imagine ideally yes, one would share insecurities and ideally one would be empathetic enough to not trigger them. However, just speaking personally, part of me feels that perhaps my own negative feelings towards a partner watching porn are unreasonable. Assuming it was a fairly standard monogamous set up I'm not being "cheated" on and it's not being done behind my back, so complaining about a harmless activity purely because of my own issues (i.e: fear or jealousy of being replaced by a porn star perhaps?) seems unfair somehow. I'm not even entirely sure why I feel displeasure at the idea, although I think most of it is "what can they give them that I can't?".

If I was to be perfectly honest though, I likely would never mention or give sign of unease for the above reason so they wouldn't have a clue. Not from fear of making my own case, more than making them feel guilty for what is really a victimless activity.

I am flat out not stimulated by pornography. Personally, I think it's gross. Not, like, "pornography is gross." But, like, I have an aversive reaction to viewing pornography myself.

That said, I think pornography should be widely available and legal, with significant attention paid to 1) any possible means of exploitation with an accompanying focus on ways to remedy that, and 2) prevention of addiction and other sorts of problems and exacerbations of mental disorders that can be caused or contributed to by pornography.

That is to say, for me pornography fits into the category of things that can be harmful if misused but should be generally allowable in a free society (alcohol, pot, tobacco, hunting, fast food, and such). We should allow the activity in general while policing the possible misuses; deciding what is a "misuse" should be based on an application of theories of social welfare and personal liberty, and not on an extrinsic moral system. In other words, we shouldn't say "act x between consenting and informed adults is wrong," rather, we should say "act x can lead to negative consequences y and z," and make laws to try to prevent y and z.

(September 19, 2016 at 7:55 pm)SenpaiNoticeMeYouBlindShmuck Wrote: However, just speaking personally, part of me feels that perhaps my own negative feelings towards a partner watching porn are unreasonable.

I hear you. It doesn't change the fact that the emotions are there, it's simply a spur to ask yourself why, right?

That's how I approach these sorts of insecurities.

I think it is fine. Though some modern problems seem to be coming up. Some men have a hard time reaching climax with a real woman if they watch too much porn.

Not much else to say besides that. I think it is not a problem. Not one noticeable at least.

(September 19, 2016 at 7:07 pm)SenpaiNoticeMeYouBlindShmuck Wrote:

(September 19, 2016 at 6:32 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: That's good that you normally don't use porn while you have a girlfriend. 

I know there's been women here who have said their husbands look at it and they don't care, but it's very different for me. I would feel devastated and betrayed if my husband had any sort of porn habit. It would make me feel inadequate and like a violation of something sacred and special that is supposed to be shared exclusively between us. But then again, that comes with the territory of having very different views of sexuality.

Catholic_Lady, if this is too personal just ignore this, but I am interested in this sense that you would feel betrayed if your partner watched porn.

From whence would you say this feeling originates? Is it a sense that he would be committing adultery by directing any form of sexual response to other women, or is it more an impassive sense of distaste through failing to uphold the moral code of your faith that I presume he either believes in or is expected to adhere to? Perhaps it has nothing to do with faith at all and you just aren't comfortable with the idea of him finding sexual stimulation, however indirectly from someone else, I'm curious.

As for the original topic...I wouldn't be thrilled by a partner watching porn after that level of intimacy had formed. I admit my own thoughts would drift towards "Am I really that shit in bed/ugly/uncreative enough they've got to `get it' elsewhere?" but I'd probably never mention it to them, since I'd personally scribe that up to my own personal insecurity rather than them actually doing something objectively bad.

Of course, it wouldn't be nearly as bad as it would be if he were to actually sleep with other women. But getting sexual gratification from other women instead of having sex with me, even if just by watching their videos, doing webcam, phone sex, receiving sexts, etc, would still make me wonder why I wasn't enough. That's where the feeling of inadequacy would come from. 

I don't think this is any more about "insecurity" as it would be if he were to actually sleep with other women rather than just get off on watching videos of them. Women who are upset after they found out their spouse slept with someone else never get told they're just being insecure. Likewise, there should be no reason for women who are upset about their spouse' porn viewing to be told they're just being insecure. It just depends on each couple's views on sex and on what they would consider crossing the line towards infidelity.   

Aside from feeling inadequate, I would also feel betrayed because my view of sex is that it is a sacred, special bond shared exclusively between my spouse and I. I purposely married someone who felt the same way. So him breaking that would be very hurtful to me. I'm not sure how I would react to something like that, or how quickly I'd be able to forgive him enough for things to go back to normal.