Stop believing in God or else God will punish you! wait a second...

(November 17, 2016 at 4:19 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(November 17, 2016 at 4:13 pm)operator Wrote: I like what you're doing here but you need to take this further to drive the point home. Go deeper into the rabbit hole.

It's just the Outsider's Test of Religion, really, presented as a personal outlook.

'The Outsider Test for Faith'...?

(November 18, 2016 at 10:57 am)operator Wrote:

(November 17, 2016 at 4:19 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: It's just the Outsider's Test of Religion, really, presented as a personal outlook.

'The Outsider Test for Faith'...?

Something like that. 

(November 17, 2016 at 4:43 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: Isn't it funny how we can call the Greek gods mythology, but people get offended if you say the same thing about Christian mythology?

Many (Most? Nearly all?) would take offense to any pairing of Christianity with mythology if by mythology you mean "not true". I do not. Greek mythology has many truths within it. Mythology and religion are parallel approaches to spiritual reality. A mythological outlook looks for truths that are not contingent on historical facts. Bibilical exegisis takes this approach as well. The story of the Exodus conveys many truths regardless of its historical accuracy or even if never happened at all. The intellectual poverty of atheism is its inability to recognize and work with truths that are not directly bound to physical facts.

(November 18, 2016 at 11:40 am)Neo-Scholastic Wrote: Many (Most? Nearly all?) would take offense to any pairing of Christianity with mythology if by mythology you mean "not true". I do not. Greek mythology has many truths within it. Mythology and religion are parallel approaches to spiritual reality. A mythological outlook looks for truths that are not contingent on historical facts. Bibilical exegisis takes this approach as well. The story of the Exodus conveys many truths regardless of its historical accuracy or even if never happened at all. The intellectual poverty of atheism is its inability to recognize and work with truths that are not directly bound to physical facts.

Christian mythology is a part of Christianity... what's offensive about that? What "truths" does Exodus, or any other part of the bible, contain? I mean if we're cherry picking here I can find "truths" in the Harry Potter books. What do you mean about the "intellectual poverty of atheism?" Atheism is simply a lack of belief in any god or gods, so I'm not sure what you're trying to get at there.

Still projecting his own wank onto atheism I see. He'll never learn I guess.

He has to strawman atheists as naturalists, and not even methodological naturalists. They have to be philosophical ones.

(November 18, 2016 at 12:40 pm)robvalue Wrote: He has to strawman atheists as naturalists, and not even methodological naturalists. They have to be philosophical ones.

Isn't a methodological naturalist, by definition a philosophical naturalist? If not what am I missing?

I consider myself to be a naturalist but one does not have to be a naturalist to be an atheist.

Philosophical denies the existence of the supernatural, whereas methodological just ignores it (if it's real) until there is a way to detect it.

The existence of my wife defeats his strawman. She is an atheist who is not a naturalist.

(November 18, 2016 at 11:46 am)operator Wrote: What do you mean about the "intellectual poverty of atheism?" Atheism is simply a lack of belief in any god or gods, so I'm not sure what you're trying to get at there.

If atheism was simply the lack of belief in god(s) then cabbages are atheists. It’s a dodge. Atheism is actually an opinion about the proposition that god(s) exist.

Robvalue retreats from my critique (atheism does not recognize and cannot work with spiritual truths) on the grounds that it was a definitive statement and not a generalization open to qualification. In fact the opinion that god(s) do not exist is overwhelmingly associated with ontological naturalism. If his wife is an exception then she is certainly in the minority.

But back on point, the topics in Exodus are not confined to a slave revolt, inexplicable plagues, and the adventures of an ancient people during migration. When someone who doesn’t believe in God reads Exodus only things such as those are subject to inquiry. Did this happen and if so when? Etc. On the other hand the believer reads the text to learn about things like Divine Providence. If someone doesn’t believe in a spiritual truth like Providence it doesn’t make any sense for him inquire about how it works.