(July 15, 2017 at 12:29 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 12:03 pm)A Theist Wrote: Thank you Rhondazvous. Much appreciated.

I raised the issue of politics because I believe the study mentioned in the OP is flawed. Like theists, atheists can't be pinned down to all believing the same way. Even in their views toward God they're different. Gnostic Atheists, Agnostic Atheists, Passive Atheists, Friendly Atheists, Indifferent Atheists,....even the well known atheist Richard Dawkins identifies himself as a "Cultural Christian". 





I think it's also falsely assumed that all atheists are left leaning. Like theists, atheists are all over the political map. For example, Capn Awesome seems to lean more toward the conservative side. Tiberius and Thump seem to be more Libertarian, while Mr. McGoofass Minimalist seems to be more of the old guard establishment liberal Democrat, and then there's the more far left members here, the Bernie Bros, and one who was posting here recently who seemed to be in line with the BAMN group. I don't know if you were around on AF at the time, but there was even a well known atheist Nazi sympathizer and holocaust denier who posted on here for a short time. Can't remember who it was, but a member recognized him and called him out. That guy didn't last long. So, I think a person's political / social beliefs are a better indicator to how open minded they are. Or, it could all be as simple as the individual's own personality trait whether they're fair minded or closed minded.

Actually, I do make a distinction between liberal and left, though. You seem to be fair minded enough to me. If you label yourself a conservative Democrat that's good enough for me as far as I'm concerned. Conservative Democrat does makes sense to me, actually. My Step Father identified himself as a conservative democrat.

As far as me, I identify with conservatives. But, my strong pro union stance would put me at odds with most Republicans.

You did a lousy job of putting it this way in your prior posts.

Yes, atheists are diverse. Just like theists are diverse. 

If you think Republicans are ever going to give one fuck about unions after Reagan busted the air traffic control unions and have been union busting ever since, you are a fool. 

What is it about "conservatives" you identify with?

"Give billionaires tax breaks they don't need"?
" Deregulation since Reagan that has cause a bubble every decade since ending with Bush's triple whammy?"
" Xenophobia of LGBT, Hispanics, Muslims and control of women's bodies"?

You can call yourself a "Conservative democrat" if you wish, but if you stupidly think the things Reagan started and that the bigotry held by the far right is good for America, sorry, that will never be my idea of progress.

Conservatives DONT "conserve" they value selfishness greed and  "fuck you I got mine".

You claim to value unions but are willing to vote for a party that has destroyed worker bargaining power for 40 years? Yep, just as insane as Caitlynn Jenner being transgender and voting for a party that hates her. The insanity is that the GOP  has successfully gotten their supporters to vote against their own self interests.

Go back and read my post again. I don't identify as a conservative democrat. Democrats only give lip service to the unions for votes. They haven't done jack shit. Otherwise there would be more legislation to help workers get organized a lot easier in the work place. David Coat, former CEO of left leaning Honeywell, and an ally and advisor to Barack Obama, is an ardent opposer of unions and was in the process breaking unions at two of their other facilities. If democrats were so much for the working people then we would have more than just two states with, "for just cause protection" laws. Democrats are all bluster and bullshit.

(July 15, 2017 at 1:05 pm)A Theist Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 12:29 pm)Brian37 Wrote: You did a lousy job of putting it this way in your prior posts.

Yes, atheists are diverse. Just like theists are diverse. 

If you think Republicans are ever going to give one fuck about unions after Reagan busted the air traffic control unions and have been union busting ever since, you are a fool. 

What is it about "conservatives" you identify with?

"Give billionaires tax breaks they don't need"?
" Deregulation since Reagan that has cause a bubble every decade since ending with Bush's triple whammy?"
" Xenophobia of LGBT, Hispanics, Muslims and control of women's bodies"?

You can call yourself a "Conservative democrat" if you wish, but if you stupidly think the things Reagan started and that the bigotry held by the far right is good for America, sorry, that will never be my idea of progress.

Conservatives DONT "conserve" they value selfishness greed and  "fuck you I got mine".

You claim to value unions but are willing to vote for a party that has destroyed worker bargaining power for 40 years? Yep, just as insane as Caitlynn Jenner being transgender and voting for a party that hates her. The insanity is that the GOP  has successfully gotten their supporters to vote against their own self interests.

Go back and read my post again. I don't identify as a conservative democrat. Democrats only give lip service to the unions for votes. They haven't done jack shit. Otherwise there would be more legislation to help workers get organized a lot easier in the work place. David Coat, former CEO of left leaning Honeywell, and an ally and advisor to Barack Obama, is an ardent opposer of unions and was in the process breaking unions at two of their other facilities. If democrats were so much for the working people then we would have more than just two states with, "for just cause protection" laws. Democrats are all bluster and bullshit.

Then what the fuck do you identify yourself with?

Secondly, I agree democrats have not done anything, not because of the party, but because of 36 years of GOP gerrymandering. Hard to get shit done when you are held hostage by the other party. 

No, just the opposite the GOP are bluster and bullshit. If they had the right formula in that 36 year period nobody would be bitching.

Quote:Go back and read my post again. I don't identify as a conservative democrat. Democrats only give lip service to the unions for votes. They haven't done jack shit. Otherwise there would be more legislation to help workers get organized a lot easier in the work place. David Coat, former CEO of left leaning Honeywell, and an ally and advisor to Barack Obama, is an ardent opposer of unions and was in the process breaking unions at two of their other facilities. If democrats were so much for the working people then we would have more than just two states with, "for just cause protection" laws. Democrats are all bluster and bullshit.

Really done nothing accept oppose "Right to work "laws ' and as Brian said it's not the party it's the Republicans who block any attempt to help unions . And Republicans are infinitely worst in fact the worst union busters there are. Icluding your orange god .

https://www.thenation.com/article/no-sur...own-hotel/

http://www.ilwu.org/trump-backs-attack-o...n-members/

(July 15, 2017 at 12:03 pm)A Theist Wrote: Thank you Rhondazvous. Much appreciated.

I raised the issue of politics because I believe the study mentioned in the OP is flawed. Like theists, atheists can't be pinned down to all believing the same way. Even in their views toward God they're different. Gnostic Atheists, Agnostic Atheists, Passive Atheists, Friendly Atheists, Indifferent Atheists,....even the well known atheist Richard Dawkins identifies himself as a "Cultural Christian". 





I think it's also falsely assumed that all atheists are left leaning. Like theists, atheists are all over the political map. For example, Capn Awesome seems to lean more toward the conservative side. Tiberius and Thump seem to be more Libertarian, while Mr. McGoofass Minimalist seems to be more of the old guard establishment liberal Democrat, and then there's the more far left members here, the Bernie Bros, and one who was posting here recently who seemed to be in line with the BAMN group. I don't know if you were around on AF at the time, but there was even a well known atheist Nazi sympathizer and holocaust denier who posted on here for a short time. Can't remember who it was, but a member recognized him and called him out. That guy didn't last long. So, I think a person's political / social beliefs are a better indicator to how open minded they are. Or, it could all be as simple as the individual's own personality trait whether they're fair minded or closed minded.

Actually, I do make a distinction between liberal and left, though. You seem to be fair minded enough to me. If you label yourself a conservative Democrat that's good enough for me as far as I'm concerned. Conservative Democrat does makes sense to me, actually. My Step Father identified himself as a conservative democrat.

As far as me, I identify with conservatives. But, my strong pro union stance would put me at odds with most Republicans.

Then I need to go back and reread the op more carefully because I was under the impression that you were in agreement with the study. I was, in fact, responding to the study, not to you personally.

What is the difference you're making between liberals and leftists?

I really don't like labels. If you're a conservative then you have to be a republican, so you have to be anti union or get out of the club. I call myself a conservative and my boy Brian puts me in a class with Trump and Reagan. I can't breathe.

"Cultural Christian?" I guess I understand that. Like the other day when the doctors damn near killed me. As I fought for consciousness, that old gospel song "Got On My Traveling Shoes" kept running through my head like a swan song. We're surrounded by the tropes of Christianity, but it means different things to different people and so does atheism.

(July 15, 2017 at 2:48 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 12:03 pm)A Theist Wrote: Thank you Rhondazvous. Much appreciated.

I raised the issue of politics because I believe the study mentioned in the OP is flawed. Like theists, atheists can't be pinned down to all believing the same way. Even in their views toward God they're different. Gnostic Atheists, Agnostic Atheists, Passive Atheists, Friendly Atheists, Indifferent Atheists,....even the well known atheist Richard Dawkins identifies himself as a "Cultural Christian". 





I think it's also falsely assumed that all atheists are left leaning. Like theists, atheists are all over the political map. For example, Capn Awesome seems to lean more toward the conservative side. Tiberius and Thump seem to be more Libertarian, while Mr. McGoofass Minimalist seems to be more of the old guard establishment liberal Democrat, and then there's the more far left members here, the Bernie Bros, and one who was posting here recently who seemed to be in line with the BAMN group. I don't know if you were around on AF at the time, but there was even a well known atheist Nazi sympathizer and holocaust denier who posted on here for a short time. Can't remember who it was, but a member recognized him and called him out. That guy didn't last long. So, I think a person's political / social beliefs are a better indicator to how open minded they are. Or, it could all be as simple as the individual's own personality trait whether they're fair minded or closed minded.

Actually, I do make a distinction between liberal and left, though. You seem to be fair minded enough to me. If you label yourself a conservative Democrat that's good enough for me as far as I'm concerned. Conservative Democrat does makes sense to me, actually. My Step Father identified himself as a conservative democrat.

As far as me, I identify with conservatives. But, my strong pro union stance would put me at odds with most Republicans.

Then I need to go back and reread the op more carefully because I was under the impression that you were in agreement with the study. I was, in fact, responding to the study, not to you personally.

What is the difference you're making between liberals and leftists?

I really don't like labels. If you're a conservative then you have to be a republican, so you have to be anti union or get out of the club. I call myself a conservative and my boy Brian puts me in a class with Trump and Reagan. I can't breathe.

"Cultural Christian?" I guess I understand that. Like the other day when the doctors damn near killed me. As I  fought for consciousness, that old gospel song "Got On My Traveling Shoes" kept running through my head like a swan song. We're surrounded by the tropes of Christianity, but it means different things to different people and so does atheism.

I see nothing good about the GOP, nothing.

If you value tax breaks for billionaires who don't need them.
If you value giving Wall Street a free for all.
If you vote for a party that discriminates against minorities such as Hispanics, Muslims and even atheists, what do you want me to say?

Yes even atheist can be conservative but that does not make voting libertarian or GOP good. I don't value Ayn Rand anymore than I value Trump or Jerry Falwell.

Right now both economic an religious conservatives vote for the party of Trump.

(July 15, 2017 at 3:12 pm)Brian37 Wrote: I see nothing good about the GOP, nothing.

If you value tax breaks for billionaires who don't need them.
If you value giving Wall Street a free for all.
If you vote for a party that discriminates against minorities such as Hispanics, Muslims and even atheists, what do you want me to say?

Yes even atheist can be conservative but that does not make voting libertarian or GOP good. I don't value Ayn Rand anymore than I value Trump or Jerry Falwell.

Right now both economic an religious conservatives vote for the party of Trump.

Brian!

I have been at AF for more than 2 years, since April 2015, but I swear, and let every member here bear witness that I will give you $100 if you can find the post where I supported the republican party or the libertarians.

This is why I don't like labels. I use one word and you think you know everything that runs through my mind. How is that different from making assumptions about what atheists think?

(July 15, 2017 at 4:03 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 3:12 pm)Brian37 Wrote: I see nothing good about the GOP, nothing.

If you value tax breaks for billionaires who don't need them.
If you value giving Wall Street a free for all.
If you vote for a party that discriminates against minorities such as Hispanics, Muslims and even atheists, what do you want me to say?

Yes even atheist can be conservative but that does not make voting libertarian or GOP good. I don't value Ayn Rand anymore than I value Trump or Jerry Falwell.

Right now both economic an religious conservatives vote for the party of Trump.

Brian!

I have been at AF for more than 2 years, since April 2015,  but I swear, and let every member here bear witness that I will give you $100 if you can find the post where I supported the republican party or the libertarians.

This is why I don't like labels.  I use one word and you think you know everything that runs through my mind. How is that different from making assumptions about what atheists think?

This thread is the FIRST time I have heard you describe yourself as a "conservative" or did I miss something?

Now feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but if you have said "I identify as a conservative", then you do agree with the GOP, or you are trying to personally re define the traditional usage of it. 

Kinda like when Christians try to separate the New Testament from the Old Testament, which cannot be done. 

At this point in history the vast majority of "conservatives" vote for the GOP or Libertarian. If you vote democrat I fail to see how that matches up. 

Now maybe your next post should define what you think "conservative" means, or should mean,  on both economic and social issues, because I wont lie, that DOES conflict with my long term knowledge of "conservatives".

(July 15, 2017 at 2:48 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 12:03 pm)A Theist Wrote: Thank you Rhondazvous. Much appreciated.

I raised the issue of politics because I believe the study mentioned in the OP is flawed. Like theists, atheists can't be pinned down to all believing the same way. Even in their views toward God they're different. Gnostic Atheists, Agnostic Atheists, Passive Atheists, Friendly Atheists, Indifferent Atheists,....even the well known atheist Richard Dawkins identifies himself as a "Cultural Christian". 





I think it's also falsely assumed that all atheists are left leaning. Like theists, atheists are all over the political map. For example, Capn Awesome seems to lean more toward the conservative side. Tiberius and Thump seem to be more Libertarian, while Mr. McGoofass Minimalist seems to be more of the old guard establishment liberal Democrat, and then there's the more far left members here, the Bernie Bros, and one who was posting here recently who seemed to be in line with the BAMN group. I don't know if you were around on AF at the time, but there was even a well known atheist Nazi sympathizer and holocaust denier who posted on here for a short time. Can't remember who it was, but a member recognized him and called him out. That guy didn't last long. So, I think a person's political / social beliefs are a better indicator to how open minded they are. Or, it could all be as simple as the individual's own personality trait whether they're fair minded or closed minded.

Actually, I do make a distinction between liberal and left, though. You seem to be fair minded enough to me. If you label yourself a conservative Democrat that's good enough for me as far as I'm concerned. Conservative Democrat does makes sense to me, actually. My Step Father identified himself as a conservative democrat.

As far as me, I identify with conservatives. But, my strong pro union stance would put me at odds with most Republicans.

Then I need to go back and reread the op more carefully because I was under the impression that you were in agreement with the study. I was, in fact, responding to the study, not to you personally.

What is the difference you're making between liberals and leftists?

I really don't like labels. If you're a conservative then you have to be a republican, so you have to be anti union or get out of the club. I call myself a conservative and my boy Brian puts me in a class with Trump and Reagan. I can't breathe.

"Cultural Christian?" I guess I understand that. Like the other day when the doctors damn near killed me. As I  fought for consciousness, that old gospel song "Got On My Traveling Shoes" kept running through my head like a swan song. We're surrounded by the tropes of Christianity, but it means different things to different people and so does atheism.

I thought the study was flawed. I don't think it proves in any way that atheists are less open minded than theists. I think how open minded people are has more to do with their political / socio views. Or, it could be just as simple as an individual's personality trait. For example, Brian displays classic leftwing 'Obsessive Trump Disorder'. A flaw in his personality. He eats, sleeps, and breathes Trump. He sees Trump everywhere. Bird shits on his head. He blames Trump. Dog pisses in his Cheerios, it's Trump's fault. You identify yourself as a conservative democrat, and all of a sudden, Brian connects you to Trump, even though you probably didn't vote for him. It's a Trump conspiracy as far as Brian is concerned.

To me, Liberals would be people like Bill Clinton. Leftist would be Bernie Sanders. The far left would be those like BAMN and ANTIFA.

Yup. I'm a Republican, but still pro union.

---

(July 15, 2017 at 2:17 pm)Tizheruk Wrote:

Quote:Go back and read my post again. I don't identify as a conservative democrat. Democrats only give lip service to the unions for votes. They haven't done jack shit. Otherwise there would be more legislation to help workers get organized a lot easier in the work place. David Coat, former CEO of left leaning Honeywell, and an ally and advisor to Barack Obama, is an ardent opposer of unions and was in the process breaking unions at two of their other facilities. If democrats were so much for the working people then we would have more than just two states with, "for just cause protection" laws. Democrats are all bluster and bullshit.

Really done nothing accept oppose "Right to work "laws ' and as Brian said it's not the party it's the Republicans who block any attempt to help unions . And Republicans are infinitely worst in fact the worst union busters there are. Icluding your orange god .

https://www.thenation.com/article/no-sur...own-hotel/

http://www.ilwu.org/trump-backs-attack-o...n-members/

No. Republicans aren't the worse. Democrats can be pretty underhanded when dealing with unions. On the surface they give lip service to labor unions to get their votes. Behind the scenes they work to undermine the unions, as in this example...

Quote:The third section, on Government Relations (GR), reveals Honeywell's hopes that its influence with the Obama administration can be leveraged to help combat union activity. Slide 18 of the confidential document states that Honeywell (HON) should “continue to grow positive relationships with elected officials, with federal agencies, focusing on local branches." These relationships, the document explains, "can be directed at union activity, if needed.” The plan suggests that Honeywell's Government Relations division can be used to “break up union cohesion across the country.” A picture of President Obama speaking at a Honeywell plant is included (see above), with a caption reading “HON has great relationships with Federal officials, focus is needed at the State and local levels."
Indeed, President Obama and Honeywell CEO Dave E. Cote have a very close relationship. Cote visited with Obama at the White House this past Wednesday to push him to cut budget spending. Cote is considered one of Obama’s closest allies in the business community. In January of 2009, Cote introduced Obama’s stimulus package in a White House speech. Cote was subsequently appointed by Obama to serve on the Deficit Commission. President Obama even flew with Cote to India while a lockout at Honeywell's Metropolis, Ill. uranium plant was ongoing. Cote returned the favor by giving heavily to the Democratic Party. In the 2010 election cycle when the Met, Honeywell was the top corporate PAC contributor to the Democratic Party.
Union activists believe that Honeywell’s federal ties have already enabled the company to call in government help when suppressing unions. In 2009, Honeywell threatened to use Marines to replace 500 United Steelworkers members in Blount Island, Fla. if the military contractors went out on strike. Honeywell had the military security clearances pulled on several of the union leaders, leading them to lose their jobs. In 2010, I exposed evidence that Honeywell cheated on qualification tests for scab replacement workers during the lockout at its Metropolis uranium facility; during the lag between my report and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission taking action, the scab replacement workers caused a number of accidents. In 2011, International Association of Machinists Lodge 778, employed as nuclear weapons workers at Honeywell’s Kansas City, accused the Department of Energy of abandoning its legal mandate by not stepping into to stop a concessionary contract Honeywell was pushing on the union. (Note: I have written over two dozen articles on this issue since 2009; for more details on the federal government enabling Honeywell anti-union strategy, see my November 2011 piece, “Is the Federal Government Helping to Bust Unions?”)
The recent leaked documents raises serious questions about whether Honeywell benefited from its relationships with the Obama administration as part of its anti-union maneuvers. The White House did not respond to request for comment.

http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14...onnections

Way to go, Obama!

(July 15, 2017 at 5:46 pm)A Theist Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 2:48 pm)Rhondazvous Wrote: Then I need to go back and reread the op more carefully because I was under the impression that you were in agreement with the study. I was, in fact, responding to the study, not to you personally.

What is the difference you're making between liberals and leftists?

I really don't like labels. If you're a conservative then you have to be a republican, so you have to be anti union or get out of the club. I call myself a conservative and my boy Brian puts me in a class with Trump and Reagan. I can't breathe.

"Cultural Christian?" I guess I understand that. Like the other day when the doctors damn near killed me. As I  fought for consciousness, that old gospel song "Got On My Traveling Shoes" kept running through my head like a swan song. We're surrounded by the tropes of Christianity, but it means different things to different people and so does atheism.

I thought the study was flawed. I don't think it proves in any way that atheists are less open minded than theists. I think how open minded people are has more to do with their political / socio views. Or, it could be just as simple as an individual's personality trait. For example, Brian displays classic leftwing 'Obsessive Trump Disorder'. A flaw in his personality. He eats, sleeps, and breathes Trump. He sees Trump everywhere. Bird shits on his head. He blames Trump. Dog pisses in his Cheerios, it's Trump's fault. You identify yourself as a conservative democrat, and all of a sudden, Brian connects you to Trump, even though you probably didn't vote for him. It's a Trump conspiracy as far as Brian is concerned.

To me, Liberals would be people like Bill Clinton. Leftist would be Bernie Sanders. The far left would be those like BAMN and ANTIFA.

Yup. I'm a Republican, but still pro union.

---

(July 15, 2017 at 2:17 pm)Tizheruk Wrote: Really done nothing accept oppose "Right to work "laws ' and as Brian said it's not the party it's the Republicans who block any attempt to help unions . And Republicans are infinitely worst in fact the worst union busters there are. Icluding your orange god .

https://www.thenation.com/article/no-sur...own-hotel/

http://www.ilwu.org/trump-backs-attack-o...n-members/

No. Republicans aren't the worse. Democrats can be pretty underhanded when dealing with unions. On the surface they give lip service to labor unions to get their votes. Behind the scenes they work to undermine the unions, as in this example...

Quote:The third section, on Government Relations (GR), reveals Honeywell's hopes that its influence with the Obama administration can be leveraged to help combat union activity. Slide 18 of the confidential document states that Honeywell (HON) should “continue to grow positive relationships with elected officials, with federal agencies, focusing on local branches." These relationships, the document explains, "can be directed at union activity, if needed.” The plan suggests that Honeywell's Government Relations division can be used to “break up union cohesion across the country.” A picture of President Obama speaking at a Honeywell plant is included (see above), with a caption reading “HON has great relationships with Federal officials, focus is needed at the State and local levels."
Indeed, President Obama and Honeywell CEO Dave E. Cote have a very close relationship. Cote visited with Obama at the White House this past Wednesday to push him to cut budget spending. Cote is considered one of Obama’s closest allies in the business community. In January of 2009, Cote introduced Obama’s stimulus package in a White House speech. Cote was subsequently appointed by Obama to serve on the Deficit Commission. President Obama even flew with Cote to India while a lockout at Honeywell's Metropolis, Ill. uranium plant was ongoing. Cote returned the favor by giving heavily to the Democratic Party. In the 2010 election cycle when the Met, Honeywell was the top corporate PAC contributor to the Democratic Party.
Union activists believe that Honeywell’s federal ties have already enabled the company to call in government help when suppressing unions. In 2009, Honeywell threatened to use Marines to replace 500 United Steelworkers members in Blount Island, Fla. if the military contractors went out on strike. Honeywell had the military security clearances pulled on several of the union leaders, leading them to lose their jobs. In 2010, I exposed evidence that Honeywell cheated on qualification tests for scab replacement workers during the lockout at its Metropolis uranium facility; during the lag between my report and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission taking action, the scab replacement workers caused a number of accidents. In 2011, International Association of Machinists Lodge 778, employed as nuclear weapons workers at Honeywell’s Kansas City, accused the Department of Energy of abandoning its legal mandate by not stepping into to stop a concessionary contract Honeywell was pushing on the union. (Note: I have written over two dozen articles on this issue since 2009; for more details on the federal government enabling Honeywell anti-union strategy, see my November 2011 piece, “Is the Federal Government Helping to Bust Unions?”)
The recent leaked documents raises serious questions about whether Honeywell benefited from its relationships with the Obama administration as part of its anti-union maneuvers. The White House did not respond to request for comment.

http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/14...onnections

Way to go, Obama!

No and bullshit. Do not confuse what dems should not be doing, which we do too much of which is compromise, as being "underhanded". You will not get away with blaming the hostages and accuse them of being the hostage takers.

REAGAN started this. Unions have been on the decline ever since. The only thing our POLITICIANS, not the voters, just our politicians can be accused of in 36 years is stupidly trying to compete with the wrong side of history. 

Again, if the GOP was so great at everything nobody would be bitching. Reagan started it and workers have been fucked ever since. I only blame dems as far as politicians for too much compromise and as far as voters too much apathy and sitting out in midterms and general elections. If we had never given up like we did when Reagan defeated the Air Traffic Control Unions, the GOP would have gone extinct back in the 80s.

If you say you value unions your are an idiot voting against your own self interests.

(July 15, 2017 at 5:41 pm)Brian37 Wrote: This thread is the FIRST time I have heard you describe yourself as a "conservative" or did I miss something?

Now feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but if you have said "I identify as a conservative", then you do agree with the GOP, or you are trying to personally re define the traditional usage of it. 

Kinda like when Christians try to separate the New Testament from the Old Testament, which cannot be done. 

At this point in history the vast majority of "conservatives" vote for the GOP or Libertarian. If you vote democrat I fail to see how that matches up. 

Now maybe your next post should define what you think "conservative" means, or should mean,  on both economic and social issues, because I wont lie, that DOES conflict with my long term knowledge of "conservatives".

Dear heart, you stand utterly corrected.

I don't care what the majority does. I am me and if you really took the time to ask me what I mean by conservative I have no problem telling you. But the last thing in the world I feel like doing is explaining myself to people who assume they already know everything and jump down my throat like their opinion is the gospel truth.