(September 4, 2017 at 8:24 pm)Whateverist Wrote:

(September 4, 2017 at 4:06 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: I am talking about the exact value we have as individuals.

Then you are talking about something I cannot understand.  Your value to your mother would be of one kind, to a mate another and to someone who only knows you only from your online presence something else altogether.  So it is unclear how you could possibly have one constant value to everyone in the world.  But of course you mean to some uber being who created you - you know - the very thing you are supposedly arguing for.  Nothing like basing your argument on your premise.

I have to go. I can't be on these forums anymore because I have to focus on school.

I never said you have the same value to everyone. Nothing like that. I am saying we have an exact objective value irrespective of the value given by others.

That despite everyone having different value given to you, you have an objective value irrespective of that.  

Anyways, something we always knew as children and still know today, but like I said God is linked to the essential foundations of what it means to be human.

He creates in truth from his vision of truth, the witness to all things.

And I would argue as I argued before, but won't elaborate and go into detail as I gone to before, you cannot give value to a human being without believing that they have an objective value irrespective of the value they mean to you or to others around you or people around them.

The witness that keeps us earning justly our true value is God Lord of the worlds, the only perfect judge capable of doing so. And there is no doubt we have an exact MEASURED value.

With peace (last post till Christmass).

(September 4, 2017 at 8:34 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: I never said you have the same value to everyone. Nothing like that. I am saying we have an exact objective value irrespective of the value given by others.

That makes no sense.  In order for that to be so, the "objective value" would have to be based on a non-sentient and fairly consistent standard, such as the mass of a protium (hydrogen-1) atom.  As soon as you introduce sentience in any form, the value shifts to the subjective side because the evaluation is now tangled up with the values and perceptions of the sentient being.

(September 4, 2017 at 8:34 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(September 4, 2017 at 8:24 pm)Whateverist Wrote: Then you are talking about something I cannot understand.  Your value to your mother would be of one kind, to a mate another and to someone who only knows you only from your online presence something else altogether.  So it is unclear how you could possibly have one constant value to everyone in the world.  But of course you mean to some uber being who created you - you know - the very thing you are supposedly arguing for.  Nothing like basing your argument on your premise.

I have to go. I can't be on these forums anymore because I have to focus on school.

I am glad that you are focusing on what's import in your life as opposed to that which is not; it is, I hope, a step in the right direction for you.  I can only wish that I would have focused on my school work during my college days instead of going off the religious deep-end.  I blew my chance at getting a PhD, which, in the end, may have been a good thing, as I doubt anyway that I could have found a job!  But, still, if I could have done things over again....

(September 4, 2017 at 8:34 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(September 4, 2017 at 8:24 pm)Whateverist Wrote: Then you are talking about something I cannot understand.  Your value to your mother would be of one kind, to a mate another and to someone who only knows you only from your online presence something else altogether.  So it is unclear how you could possibly have one constant value to everyone in the world.  But of course you mean to some uber being who created you - you know - the very thing you are supposedly arguing for.  Nothing like basing your argument on your premise.

I have to go. I can't be on these forums anymore because I have to focus on school.

I never said you have the same value to everyone. Nothing like that. I am saying we have an exact objective value irrespective of the value given by others.

That despite everyone having different value given to you, you have an objective value irrespective of that.  

Anyways, something we always knew as children and still know today, but like I said God is linked to the essential foundations of what it means to be human.

He creates in truth from his vision of truth, the witness to all things.

And I would argue as I argued before, but won't elaborate and go into detail as I gone to before, you cannot give value to a human being without believing that they have an objective value irrespective of the value they mean to you or to others around you or people around them.

The witness that keeps us earning justly our true value is God Lord of the worlds, the only perfect judge capable of doing so. And there is no doubt we have an exact MEASURED value.

With peace (last post till Christmass).

Don't worry we'll be fine until then.  Peace be with (or is it upon?) you.

(September 5, 2017 at 12:22 am)Whateverist Wrote:

(September 4, 2017 at 8:34 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: I have to go. I can't be on these forums anymore because I have to focus on school.

I never said you have the same value to everyone. Nothing like that. I am saying we have an exact objective value irrespective of the value given by others.

That despite everyone having different value given to you, you have an objective value irrespective of that.  

Anyways, something we always knew as children and still know today, but like I said God is linked to the essential foundations of what it means to be human.

He creates in truth from his vision of truth, the witness to all things.

And I would argue as I argued before, but won't elaborate and go into detail as I gone to before, you cannot give value to a human being without believing that they have an objective value irrespective of the value they mean to you or to others around you or people around them.

The witness that keeps us earning justly our true value is God Lord of the worlds, the only perfect judge capable of doing so. And there is no doubt we have an exact MEASURED value.

With peace (last post till Christmass).

Don't worry we'll be fine until then.  Peace be with (or is it upon?) you.

You spelled "piss" wrong...

(September 4, 2017 at 6:48 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(September 4, 2017 at 6:32 pm)pocaracas Wrote: Says you!
I disagree.

But tell me, where did you get this information? How did you get it?

From the only means possible to know the truth to this answer.

Where did you get your view from?

From the only means possible to know the truth to this answer.

When you get back, you can tell me if that's a satisfactory answer.

Thank God you're here, Steve. ProgrammingNobBoredom needs banning again. Pretty please? If only as a birthday present from you to me?

(September 4, 2017 at 6:48 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(September 4, 2017 at 6:32 pm)pocaracas Wrote: Says you!
I disagree.

But tell me, where did you get this information? How did you get it?

From the only means possible to know the truth to this answer.

Where did you get your view from?

And another dodge...

You find out the truth by investigating reality. Tell me, what steps have you taken to find that "human beings [have] an exact objective value"?
I may come to agree with you, if you tell me your steps and I find them reliable.

But, thus far... you failed to even define value.
According to the definition of value that I'm aware of, it is something attributed by people towards anything else, including people (others and themselves).

But feel free to define it in your own way and then define the concept of "exact objective value".... I can wait until Christmas.

MysticKnight Wrote:It is so manifest, so apparent, so clear, that something sees us as we are. But what is that something that creates us and sees us as we TRULY ARE. It is the perfect judge.

It is what knows our inner secret, and what is inner to that. That which creates us and maintains us and holds us by all that what we have earned.

It is so manifest, so clear, that something can have an exact value without anyone knowing what it is.

---

MysticKnight Wrote:The value of human beings has an exact objective value irrespective of what other humans attribute them or what they attribute themselves.

That is what is known 'in the biz' as an unsupported assertion. It is well-established that no evidence or logic is needed to justifying dismissing such statements out-of-hand.

Wait...you do know value is completely relative, right?

You do know that, right?