(October 20, 2017 at 9:27 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Rich talk about people changing their beliefs for a guy who always argues humans can never choose their beliefs.

Oh man.... how you guys are constantly contradicting yourselves.

I've never claimed to have chosen any beliefs.

Oh man . . . how can you ever be expected to hold your own in a debate if you can't even read?

---

(October 20, 2017 at 9:27 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Oh man.... how you guys are constantly contradicting yourselves.

Frigging hell. But you're a walking, burping, farting, bullshitting, puking, (and most likely BJ-giving) self-contradiction, MK.

(October 20, 2017 at 9:30 pm)Hammy Wrote:

(October 20, 2017 at 9:27 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Rich talk about people changing their beliefs for a guy who always argues humans can never choose their beliefs.

Oh man.... how you guys are constantly contradicting yourselves.

I've never claimed to have chosen any beliefs.

Oh man . . . how can you ever be expected to hold your own in a debate if you can't even read?

Your tone shows enough pride for that claim and your tone shows enough disapproval in my choice. 

Let us be honest for once,  you can't sort knowledge from doubts if you are not honest to yourself. And that is all the matter of faith comes down to,  being honest to yourself, which is a choice. And hence, your we can't choose our beliefs which partially is true, gets destroyed. 

We can't choose our beliefs in the sense honestly believe in a falsehood, however we can choose to deceive ourselves or be honest with ourselves, and that provides either confusion (in deceiving oneself) or clarity (in being honest to oneself).

And that is all it comes down to, responsibility to what our hearts accept and follow and believe and value.

(October 20, 2017 at 9:20 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(October 20, 2017 at 8:59 pm)Joods Wrote: Loving who you want to love isn't wrong. 

Loving them as a friend or brother in humanity or faith is not wrong. Loving who you want sexually is wrong. For example, your siblings, your mother, your father, being attracted to them sexually is wrong, acting on such feelings is even worse.

Like the religious fuck-wit you've become, you now parrot the teachings of other religious fuck-wits in  drawing a comparison between homosexuality and incest. You probably believe that incest is more prevalent in homosexuals too, don't you?

(October 20, 2017 at 7:18 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:

(October 20, 2017 at 6:32 pm)Whateverist Wrote: New rules: all English words shall have but one usage.  

Oh wait, I guess the rules for word usage in English isn't up for grabs.  NM

I still read books.

Dinosaur!

(October 20, 2017 at 9:37 pm)The Gentleman Bastard Wrote:

(October 20, 2017 at 9:20 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Loving them as a friend or brother in humanity or faith is not wrong. Loving who you want sexually is wrong. For example, your siblings, your mother, your father, being attracted to them sexually is wrong, acting on such feelings is even worse.

Like the religious fuck-wit you've become, you now parrot the teachings of other religious fuck-wits in  drawing a comparison between homosexuality and incest. You probably believe that incest is more prevalent in homosexuals too, don't you?

I went on to say, she had the exception in mind, so I am not using that at all, nor did I compare the two. I am attacking the premise, but even in that, said I knew she had that exception in mind so am not holding it against the generality of the premise. But then I showed the generality get's destroyed even further and is generally not true.

And then I made an argument that was unrelated to all that, which showed to be evil and wrong as well. And it is another argument, that provides clarity.  Let us be honest to yourselves You guys don't want morals to be clear, you don't want good and evil to be clearly defined.

You want a soup of grey where you choose to hold on to whatever you like and make your own standards. For a people who always argue there are no objective morals at all, you guys are very adamant for the morals you believe.

Where's a big fat facepalm when you need one.

(October 20, 2017 at 9:33 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: Your tone shows enough pride for that claim and your tone shows enough disapproval in my choice. 

So now you wanna go ahead and pretend to read my mind?

I don't disapprove of your 'choice' I disapprove of your stupid fucking bigoted beliefs.

Quote:Let us be honest for once,  you can't sort knowledge from doubts if you are not honest to yourself.

I have never known a single person in my whole life who is MORE honest than me. I'm compulsively honest. I honestly have no memory of ever telling a lie (jokes and deception in games like poker and mafia don't count... I'm talking about stating something I don't really believe specifically in order to deceive someone, including all other "white lies" here) in my whole life. Although I may have done in childhood I have no memory of it and I assume being caught must have brought me so much pain that I never lied again and have a phobia or telling likes or something like that.

Anyway, there's no question that I'm infinitely more honest than you are.

Quote: And that is all the matter of faith comes down to,  being honest to yourself, which is a choice.

For me it's a compulsion. And what horseshit. Your stupid fucking magic book is full of all sorts of bullshit commands and none of them are choices to follow. You follow them because you are convinced by such horseshit because you're a fucking unintelligent and hateful idiot at worst and brainwashed little pathetic sod at best.

Quote:And hence, your we can't choose our beliefs which partially is true, gets destroyed. 

It's completely true that beliefs are entirely not chosen. That is the very opposite of how beliefs work. Beliefs are about being convinced or not convinced by your own experience of reality as it presents itself. It's as far from a choice as you can get. It isn't even an unfree choice. It's not a decision at all. Your own perception of reality hits whether real or unreal and you have no choice but to believe that perception unless you convince yourself you are hallucinating.

Quote:We can't choose our beliefs in the sense honestly believe in a falsehood, however we can choose to deceive ourselves or be honest with ourselves, and that provides either confusion (in deceiving oneself) or clarity (in being honest to oneself).

No, we can't choose to deceive ourselves because then we'd be aware of our own deception and hence not self-deceived. So we can't even unfreely choose to do that. We cannot choose to do that at all.

Quote:And that is all it comes down to, responsibility to what our hearts accept and follow and believe and value.

And the fact you honestly believe (which is a fucking tautology by the way........ you're being a fucktard by wasting your time talking about differences between 'honest' and 'dishonest' belief...... ALL BELIEF IS HONEST OR ELSE IT'S NOT A BELIEF AT ALL. HONESTY IS STATING WHAT YOU BELIEVE. LYING IS STATING WHAT YOU DO NOT BELIEVE (and it's not a joke or a bluff... that's what lying is)) this bullshit only demonstrates how unintelligent you are.

Not shouting, emphasis, by the way. I am more rational and sane than you will ever dream of.

Now, kindly fuck off (all my swearing is intentional and to try and help get the message across, I'm completely in control of my own emotions here. If I even have emotions that is) . . . kindly fuck off. I'm bored of wasting my time arguing with a bigoted moron.

(October 20, 2017 at 9:20 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(October 20, 2017 at 8:59 pm)Joods Wrote: Loving who you want to love isn't wrong. 

Loving them as a friend or brother in humanity or faith is not wrong. Loving who you want sexually is wrong.

No it isn't. And you know it. Again - just because your stupid book tells you X doesn't make it fact or true. 

Quote:For example, your siblings, your mother, your father, being attracted to them sexually is wrong, acting on such feelings is even worse.

Well no shit, Sherlock. But we aren't talking about incest. We are talking about two same sex people who are NOT related. But, typical that you change the goal posts to suit your agenda. Why am I not surprised. Been taking notes from Huggy or Dripshit lately?

Quote:So this premise is faulty, but I know you had that exception in mind, so I won't be petty and do away with your overall statement with exceptions.

Yet you did anyway. So why even bother to mention it? You knew exactly what I was referring to because it's YOUR TOPIC of discussion in this thread. 

Quote:To love who we want is wrong in many instances. Loving a married person is wrong.  Acting on it to the extent we break it, is even worse.

And loving people who are murderers or racist is also wrong. It is not enough to be sexually attracted to them, but they must be of good moral character.

And I can keep going. 

And again - you just shift those goal posts to suit your own agenda. Look this shit is getting old and tiring with you. You are presented with rebuttals to your Quran and have been told numerous times that being gay isn't a choice - even by gay people, yet you refuse to listen. Remain ignorant. I do believe you'd rather like to be that way intentionally. 

Quote:But this might seem all irrelevant but is it?  I think in general men are meant for women and women are for men, and even the societies who had minorities doing the opposite, the majority was not choosing to bisexual and indifferent to who they are attracted to.

If it is not a choice, yes, it's not evil, but if it is a choice, then why do most humans not choose to be bisexual.

It's not a choice. Being bisexual just means you have more options to pick from in your life. Where is that wrong? Answer: It isn't wrong. 

Quote:

---

And the people social engineering society, don't even believe it is not a choice even though that is what they teach,  they in fact believe the best and complete form of love is to love both men and women sexually equally.

But most people don't embrace that and find love to the same degrading or repuslive. Even secular people who defend gay people will talk about sex with same gender in a degrading way often and degrading tone.  Or will make mockery and jokes about it.

This is has to tell you a lot. You are seeing what is clearly in front of you.


There is another argument I will make, if it was good to love same gender sexually for some humans, it would be good for all humans to do so. It is not good for all humans to do so, therefore it is not good for any humans to do so.

In fact, this is a strong argument though it may seem silly. We apply to almost all morals, and there maybe exceptions, but almost all morals, works in the way that we inspire and take example of one another.

If both were beautiful, and one was not repulsive, disgusting, and ugly,   humanity would on the most part choose to be bisexual.

And the illuminati, that is what they believe human enlightened society will be. They will be bisexual and practice sexuality love in equal manner to both. And if the premises you are arguing are true, that both are beautiful or equally honorable or good, then we should embrace both. But we know should not now, generations immersed in more illusions of darkness and desires and ignorance, I don't know what they will decide.

Let us hope - regardless of what the the truth is - humans begin to reflect sincerely and not just through parroting things without insight and reflection.

---

You've addressed nothing in any post I've made. You are as pointless and as useless as this entire thread. The only good thing that's come out of this thread is that I finally had an excellent reason to share the picture of my son and his boyfriend, basically telling everyone who can't accept their relationship, to fuck the fuck off.

Can someone else than me point to how Hammy contradicted himself in his post? That he is in a big contradiction. Atheists should help Atheists wake up from contradictions they are in as well or are you guys just here together to increases yourselves in blindness and error?

Someone spell it out for him, he can't be angry me for beliefs I hold without believing there are elements of free-will for holding those beliefs. And convince him by his tone, he is sure is angry.

(October 20, 2017 at 9:27 pm)MysticKnight Wrote:

(October 20, 2017 at 9:24 pm)Hammy Wrote: Unfortunately I have to admit that I can't say the same for myself. When I was a young adolescent... like 12-14 I was rather homophobic after my own homophobic father drummed into me the idea that homosexuality was 'unnatural' and I just took that on faith as 'bad' like a load of the other horrid shit he used to brainwash me with. I accpeted it unquestionably without even thinking about it (plus when you have a manipulative and abusive father from a young age they can pretty much convince you that the definition of true is "What dad says.")

I was young, ignorant, and so brainwashed that I scarcely even had any opinions of my own (my father was also narcissistic and sociopathic and presumably still is) . . . but thankfully people can change.

But I won't hold my breath waiting for MK to change any time soon, or ever, for the better though. I haven't been homophobic since I was about 15. I'm now 29. And if anything MK seems to have only gotten worse (he probably engaged in some gay sex recently and hated himself for it because magic book).

Rich talk about people changing their beliefs for a guy who always argues humans can never choose their beliefs.

Oh man.... how you guys are constantly contradicting yourselves.

Holding the position that we do not choose what we believe in no way contradicts the idea that what we believe can change. You're just being stupid now.