(November 17, 2017 at 6:10 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Obfuscation, exasperation, perplexity, redefinition, appeals to hypocrisy, and good old fashioned flat out denial.  This is just what I've seen -from- them in attempting to do so, anyway.

The only way to break the hold of crap gods, as far as the godly are concerned.... is to get new ones.  That's pretty much the story of religion.  It's not as if you couldn't use a bit yourself.  Following christ?  Not exactly a moral god himself.  Welcome back, btw, seems like it's been a bit.

Thanks. I have been where I have been needed more to fight those you describe so accurately. My kingdom for such eloquence.

As to me, I have found a moral God. The Gnostic Christian one who follows the ways of the other Jesus that speaks from scriptures. Not the one Christians follow.

See for yourself how much better he is as he tries to free people from traditional dogma and religions, not slave people to those poor traditions and religions the way the Christian Jesus does.

I hope you like Alan Watts. My favorite philosopher.

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesf...r_embedded

Regards
DL

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(November 17, 2017 at 7:46 pm)vorlon13 Wrote: What's wrong with The Lord God Almighty getting pissed off when a menstruating woman dishonors His Holy Church by trying to get in ??

Indeed. Especially when the sheeple want to be washed in the blood of their scapegoat Jesus.

Regards
DL

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(November 18, 2017 at 6:07 am)alpha male Wrote:

(November 17, 2017 at 5:31 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order.

See bolded. God isn't a man, so your point falls apart.

In my religion, God has to submit to man and not man to God. It is more like Buddhism and Karaite Jewry.

The point was that Christians have to form an immoral double standard to follow their genocidal son murdering prick of a God.

Regards
DL

Good for you GIA.

Hewing closer to Jesus and His teachings, eschewing the wholesale rewrite Apostle Paul foisted upon the gullibles of his time is the 'money meets the hiway' thing I've been harping about here for so long:

Christianity is a religion about Jesus. The religion of Jesus, Apocalyptic Judaism is virtually unknown in US Christendom.

I'd point out it should be apparent to Jesus' followers that following the religion Jesus preached would be right in line with His expectations, but any time I have, it has fallen on deaf (willfully deaf) ears.

(November 18, 2017 at 8:43 am)Industrial Lad Wrote: Leaders should be more accountable than those they lead, not less so.

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Not that the god described in the Christian bible seems like much of a leader. More of a third world dictator.

I agree. They are in a position of trust.

Tell that to pedophile priests and the Pope who protects them thanks to our legal system allowing perpetrators to buy their way out of justice so that they can move to their next victims.

To see the vast number of times that happens, watch the movie Spotlight.

Regards
DL

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(November 18, 2017 at 8:45 am)mh.brewer Wrote: Selective exposure.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_exposure_theory

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That is a part of it for sure but does not explain how they can adore a genocidal son murdering God.

That has to take more than confirmation bias.

I blame our tribal natures and peer pressure more.

Regards
DL

(November 18, 2017 at 2:29 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: The point was that Christians have to form an immoral double standard

Double standards aren't necessarily immoral. We apply them, properly, all the time.

(November 18, 2017 at 6:07 am)alpha male Wrote:

(November 17, 2017 at 5:31 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order.

See bolded. God isn't a man, so your point falls apart.

So what? Why should your god get special exemption? How can we claim he's good, when many of his actions are normally considered evil?

(November 18, 2017 at 3:22 pm)Chad32 Wrote: So what? Why should your god get special exemption? How can we claim he's good, when many of his actions are normally considered evil?

Standard operating procedure. Go to a grocery store. Check out the meat section. Check out the pest control section. We routinely kill other beings merely because they're tasty or a minor annoyance. We conveniently draw the "immoral" line at ourselves, and some animals like dogs and cats that amuse us.

There are things that we do to each other that are normally considered evil, but we give ourselves exemption when we do those things to beings which we consider lesser than ourselves. Since we're lesser beings than God, it's not "special" to say that God can therefore do as he wants with us.

(November 18, 2017 at 2:56 pm)alpha male Wrote:

(November 18, 2017 at 2:29 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: The point was that Christians have to form an immoral double standard

Double standards aren't necessarily immoral. We apply them, properly, all the time.

I would have to have an example of this before judging if you are correct or not.

Show what you mean.

Regards
DL

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(November 18, 2017 at 3:47 pm)alpha male Wrote:

(November 18, 2017 at 3:22 pm)Chad32 Wrote: So what? Why should your god get special exemption? How can we claim he's good, when many of his actions are normally considered evil?

Standard operating procedure. Go to a grocery store. Check out the meat section. Check out the pest control section. We routinely kill other beings merely because they're tasty or a minor annoyance. We conveniently draw the "immoral" line at ourselves, and some animals like dogs and cats that amuse us.

There are things that we do to each other that are normally considered evil, but we give ourselves exemption when we do those things to beings which we consider lesser than ourselves. Since we're lesser beings than God, it's not "special" to say that God can therefore do as he wants with us.

God can cure and make the lesser equal if he chooses to do so. We cannot.

The high moral ground is to make equal while the low moral ground is to kill.

Regards
DL

(November 18, 2017 at 3:47 pm)alpha male Wrote:

(November 18, 2017 at 3:22 pm)Chad32 Wrote: So what? Why should your god get special exemption? How can we claim he's good, when many of his actions are normally considered evil?

Standard operating procedure. Go to a grocery store. Check out the meat section. Check out the pest control section. We routinely kill other beings merely because they're tasty or a minor annoyance. We conveniently draw the "immoral" line at ourselves, and some animals like dogs and cats that amuse us.

There are things that we do to each other that are normally considered evil, but we give ourselves exemption when we do those things to beings which we consider lesser than ourselves. Since we're lesser beings than God, it's not "special" to say that God can therefore do as he wants with us.

So he's no more enlightened than we are?

(November 17, 2017 at 5:31 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: How and why can people ignore their God’s immoral ways?
 
I find it quite strange that Christian, Muslims and Jews can ignore the immoral ways that their God is shown to have in the Bible, Qur’an and Talmud.
 
If you have read any of the critical books on God, you will have seen God described with some rather disingenuous terms that, if applied to a man, would see that man executed by any moral government in quick order. The Buddhist saying that if you ever meet God, kill him seems quite fitting. Frankly, I think killing him without making him suffer for a time would be too good for him. If hell were real, that would be a better end for him as mankind would surely need to see that torture to gain real closure for God’s crimes against humanity. This aside.
 
I can appreciate the value for society of local churches, mosques and temples but cannot fathom why lying priests, preachers and imams try to sell their God as a good God, when he is obviously more satanic than Satan. Perhaps scripture speak at least one truth in that the whole world would be deceived by Satan and his lying preachers and imams. Not that I believe in Satan.
 
As a Gnostic Christian, my focus has been to try to become a Parfait, a perfected moral man, using the methods Jesus taught. It has been a long climb up Jacob’s ladder and apotheosis put me up one rung and I have tried to climb higher, but seem to have stalled due to my inability to find arguments that are persuasive enough to loosen Satan’s grip on the minds of Christians, Muslims and Jews. Their need of fellowship is stronger than their work on their moral sense and they stay in their religions even though they know that their God is immoral and not worthy of their idol worship. This Gnostic Christian truth is not a flattering epithet for God, which is likely what cause their destruction by Inquisition.
 
The truth hurts the religious even when given with a loving touch. I am not that good at that but have seen good honest lovers of Christ get verbally abused by theists. They think hate is motivating those who speak against their God even when love is the motivator. Hate is born of love, and the Gnostic hate of God is justified on moral grounds, and the attempted correction of a believers moral sense and their thinking is done out of love. They forget that that is how Jesus was and how that love driven expression of hate with what he saw around him almost got him killed at the hands of the Jews. So the myth says.
 
The fact that I have had many theists resist entering into moral argument of their God indicates that they know that their God is immoral. I can appreciate that once a person accepts the fellowship that his tribal nature seeks, and he can survive without having better morals, he is loath to jeopardize the comfort zone he has created for himself. The problem is that theists are living in self-deception and for one who seeks or has attained Gnosis, a deeper knowing of himself, self-deception is basically not allowed. That is why I have to bother fighting a fight that is almost un-winnable.
 
If you have an answer to the question I posed at the onset, please enlighten me as I am quite disappointed to see so many living in self-deception and without Gnosis, and following Gods who are demonstrably more Satan like than God like.
 
In the terrible days that we will face from environmental degradation that will soon be upon us, a new and moral God will be required and we presently do not have one.
 
I recognize that our tribal and fellowship needs are quite strong and a part of our basic instincts. Do you have any idea as to how we can break Satan’s hold on Christians, Muslims and Jews and change their fellowship and tribal needs to a need for a God with decent moral values?
 
Regards
DL

  How can you assert such things without first proving them, seems you are a very confused person, get the game right, please.

GC

(November 18, 2017 at 2:29 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: I hope you like Alan Watts. My favorite philosopher.

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesf...r_embedded

Regards
DL

I wouldn't call Watts a philosopher himself though. Most of his ideas are merely interpretations of Eastern philosophers that came long before him.