(November 3, 2017 at 7:44 am)Wololo Wrote:

(November 2, 2017 at 5:42 pm)speedyj1992 Wrote: The argument in response is that 1) God did show up, and revealed Himself to many people over many years. He is not obligated to us because we have forsaken Him and often continue to do so. Plus, you can't know an infinite God all at once when you're finite. That process needs to be there. 

2) The difference is you're talking about people who came after the apostles. The apostles themselves didn't have to die for Jesus' name's sake, in theory, except that they clearly really believed the things they preached because they knew the man. Why would they die for something they didn't believe in?

What evidence can you provide for tour two claims, first of all that god was ever evident(ps the bible is the claim so inadmissable as evidence) and secondly that the apostles lived and dued?

Hmm, why is the Bible completely inadmissiable as evidence? But outside of the Bible, I have a different thread going on somewhere about how it's statistically impossible for life to form by itself based on the evidence of what we currently know about how it could possibly happen (as in many zeroes beyond the realm of possibility). So, if I say God is evident, it comes from there: until we have any compelling evidence for abiogenesis as a source of life or some other possibility that doesn't lead to more questions than answers, God's existence makes by far the most sense. Regarding the second, the life and death of the apostles is actually historically recorded - you won't find it in the Bible because it's not recorded in the Bible because it's extra-Biblical.

-and in that other thread, you're bombing as badly as you are in this one. Arguments from incredulity and ignorance don't lead to anything other than an admission of incredulity and ignorance. As to why it's ill-advised to answer the question of why you believe in magic book by saying "because magic book".....just sit on it for a moment, I think it'll come to you. Try it in a swivel chair. The "life and death of the apostles" is legend -at best-, but more likely myth. Not that it would matter either way. London is a real place, and Mina Harker was based on a real person(s)....the narrative arc of the story expresses a very real historical resentment and zeitgeist. That doesn't mean that Dracula is a historical document. The number of people who believe in vampires or even that they personally -are- one doesn't change that an iota.

(November 6, 2017 at 5:49 pm)speedyj1992 Wrote: Hmm, why is the Bible completely inadmissiable as evidence? But outside of the Bible, I have a different thread going on somewhere about how it's statistically impossible for life to form by itself based on the evidence of what we currently know about how it could possibly happen (as in many zeroes beyond the realm of possibility). So, if I say God is evident, it comes from there: until we have any compelling evidence for abiogenesis as a source of life or some other possibility that doesn't lead to more questions than answers, God's existence makes by far the most sense. Regarding the second, the life and death of the apostles is actually historically recorded - you won't find it in the Bible because it's not recorded in the Bible because it's extra-Biblical.

I take it that a magic answer, to make you feel good, is better than no answer, as in we don't know yet. 

Read this: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Biblical_s...fic_errors

How many bad christian answers have current day christians had to correct? Think of that one astronomer guy.

(November 6, 2017 at 5:41 pm)speedyj1992 Wrote: Do you live in the USA?

I'm Irish, and I've a very good idea of what it is to live in a country which only accepts one version of christianity as truth.

PS If you think christians are a persecuted group then you've lived a very sheltered and uncurious life.

(November 6, 2017 at 6:43 pm)Wololo Wrote:

(November 6, 2017 at 5:41 pm)speedyj1992 Wrote: Do you live in the USA?

I'm Irish, and I've a very good idea of what it is to live in a country which only accepts one version of christianity as truth.

PS If you think christians are a persecuted group then you've lived a very sheltered and uncurious life.

Ah - I'm very sorry for your exposure to Christianity that has really fallen short of God's glory. There's another comment I left talking about friends I've had and actual news reports of Christians in other countries that are killed for their faith (it's particularly bad in the Middle East). Very unfortunate stuff.

A silly reason to die, if ever there were one.

No most Christians are better then there god .So it's him who  falls short .

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(November 20, 2017 at 7:48 pm)Khemikal Wrote: A silly reason to die, if ever there were one.

Yup utterly absurd

[quote='Tizheruk' pid='1660644' dateline='1511222462']
No most Christians are better then there god .So it's him who  falls short .

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[quote='Khemikal' pid='1660638' dateline='1511221683']

I'd like to hear more of your logic on why most Christians are better than the God we worship.

Ever ordered anyone to engage in ethnic cleansing or sex trafficking?  Would you do either?  If someone brought you her sick kid and asked for tylenol would you question whether her ethnicity disqualified her child from deserving it? Would you set fire to people who did not pledge loyalty to you? If you could command bears, would you command them to slaughter children for making fun of a bald mans head? What are your thoughts on drowning every living creature? If you could place curses on people, would you? How likely are you to incite a global xenocidal war?

(November 21, 2017 at 9:28 am)Khemikal Wrote: Ever ordered anyone to engage in ethnic cleansing or sex trafficking?  Would you do either?  If someone brought you her sick kid and asked for tylenol would you question whether her ethnicity disqualified her child from deserving it?  Would you set fire to people who did not pledge loyalty to you?  If you could command bears, would you command them to slaughter children for making fun of a bald mans head?  What are your thoughts on drowning every living creature?  If you could place curses on people, would you?  How likely are you to incite a global xenocidal war?

Some of what you said is somewhat vague in nature, so I'm not sure what you're referring to. In response to what I can tell you ARE referring to:

Noah's flood - from reading Genesis, you can tell that the world was in just the worst place its ever been in. God was under no obligation to let things keep going - I imagine you have a sense of justice, which is great. But God has more mercy than anyone, than EVERYONE, so the flood was done for the purposes of cleansing the world, and notice that the world still goes on today because it wasn't an end. "Every living creature" implies an end that neither of us believe happened, esp. since 2 of every kind went on the ark.

The bears and the youths - What's presented in the Bible in that section is that the youths who make fun of Elijah aren't just your ordinary kids, but actual gang members who were a plague on the city at the time. So they're not as innocent as most people see them as.

Inciting wars - same idea as Noah's ark, except God gave nations chances to turn away from their evil ways repeatedly, and they never did. He just chose to bring about justice through other nations, showing dominion over the hearts of men.

If you want to hear me address your other points, please be a little more specific as to what you're referring to.