It doesn't seem as if everyone the cops shoot (or beat the living shit out of, for that matter) were trying to commit suicide by cop, Faith.  Sure, sure, they were told to stop resisting - but I don't think that's a capital offense anywhere in the us, either.

Cops can, in fact "just not shoot people". Cops all over the world and here in the US manage..somehow. The problem is obviously not those cops, agreed? One can be thinking clearly about how reality works and not shoot a person..even if that person was a cop doing cop stuff...even then, they can clearly think about how reality works...and that won't yield a man shot by police. Agreed?

(January 5, 2018 at 6:00 pm)FFaith Wrote:

(January 5, 2018 at 1:15 pm)Shell B Wrote: Maybe let's not do this in areas where there isn't rampant racism. In the split second it takes for someone to shoot you, you don't have time to call number 10 and wait for him to show up. Tasers aren't always effective, either. To be clear, I want lots and lots of regulation on firearms. I just want them to be logical. Police officers need to do better. They need better screening, better training, better equipment, etc. They need to make sure there are at least two cops in every patrol car, since it's often lone cops that panic and do something stupid. I know it isn't always, but addressing some problems is better than none.

One thing they do NOT need is better equipment, but they are getting plenty. Militarization of the police is ramping up, and that's not a good thing. That's another extreme. The US is already enough of a police state as is. Wanting the police to have way better equipment and wanting the police to have no guns at all are both terrible propositions.

I agree. 

We cant keep making police survival about material things. Everyone wants cops to make it home safely. I am sure Shell B does too. 

It isn't a matter of us vs them, cops vs society or society vs cops. Or I should say, it should not be.

The biggest thing, is economics, the second thing is TRUST. But neither of that can happen between society and cops if both have to fear the other being armed to the teeth. 

Now, don't get me wrong, I am not saying not armed at all, but again, both are flooded with weapons and that is good for profits, but lousy for creating trust between cops and society.

The "better" to me is not making so many. The "better" to me is not allowing combat spray weapons in private hands, or big clips. If you don't want cops armed with spray weapons and big clips, then why should they have to fear a public with the same thing?

And we SHOULD make it harder for domestic abusers, the mentally ill, and domestic and foreign terrorists to get their hands on them. No record at time of buy does not prevent the buyer from hurting others after the buy.

"We cant keep making police survival about material things."

"We can't keep making police survival solely about material things."

"We don't make police survival solely about material things."

Honestly, to you folks read what you post?

Quote:August 1, 1966,

Once in 52 years.  Excellent justification for turning the cops into the First Panzer Division.

As I recall you love to use math. G/S.

(January 5, 2018 at 6:57 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: "We cant keep making police survival about material things."

"We can't keep making police survival solely about material things."

"We don't make police survival solely about material things."

Honestly, to you folks read what you post?

Come on really?

Nobody here is claiming you don't need air or food, of course we do, and yes they are material things.

Nobody is arguing cops don't need things. That is simply stupid to claim.

If you don't like cops shooting unarmed people, and you also want cops to make it home safely, then BALANCE is the key, not all or nothing. And right now BOTH society and cops are WAY over armed.

Why is it our allies have FAR LESS firearm deaths, EVEN when NOT talking about cops being killed, or cops killing people?

OF COURSE cops need material things. I need food and a house and money to pay my bills too. I want cops to make it home at night as much as you do. But WE make cop's jobs much harder when they have to fear getting  shot at every traffic stop. 

I AM SUGGESTING the issue SHOULD NOT BE material things for either COPS or society but ATTITUDE about HOW both cops and society view firearms. 

If society doesn't want cops shooting them with firearms, and cops dont want society shooting them with firearms, then the issue isn't food or pay or a job, but MARKETING of fear by the industry which pits society against cops and cops against society.

(January 5, 2018 at 7:06 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:August 1, 1966,

Once in 52 years.  Excellent justification for turning the cops into the First Panzer Division.

As I recall you love to use math. G/S.

As I recall you think I said I mentioned all the instances similar to that one.

(January 5, 2018 at 6:00 pm)FFaith Wrote:

(January 5, 2018 at 1:15 pm)Shell B Wrote: Maybe let's not do this in areas where there isn't rampant racism. In the split second it takes for someone to shoot you, you don't have time to call number 10 and wait for him to show up. Tasers aren't always effective, either. To be clear, I want lots and lots of regulation on firearms. I just want them to be logical. Police officers need to do better. They need better screening, better training, better equipment, etc. They need to make sure there are at least two cops in every patrol car, since it's often lone cops that panic and do something stupid. I know it isn't always, but addressing some problems is better than none.

One thing they do NOT need is better equipment, but they are getting plenty. Militarization of the police is ramping up, and that's not a good thing. That's another extreme. The US is already enough of a police state as is. Wanting the police to have way better equipment and wanting the police to have no guns at all are both terrible propositions.

Why do you assume I mean weapons when I say better equipment? I actually had in mind non-lethal methods of keeping themselves and the public safe, even if we need new innovations to make that happen. I never for a second was thinking better guns.

(January 5, 2018 at 7:20 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(January 5, 2018 at 7:06 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Once in 52 years.  Excellent justification for turning the cops into the First Panzer Division.

As I recall you love to use math. G/S.

As I recall you think I said I mentioned all the instances similar to that one.

I'm just going by what you wrote.

Your precious cops killed 3.25 people per day in 2017.  Let's see you come up with as many examples where tanks saved lives.

I'll wait.

(January 5, 2018 at 7:55 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

(January 5, 2018 at 7:20 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: As I recall you think I said I mentioned all the instances similar to that one.

I'm just going by what you wrote.

Your precious cops killed 3.25 people per day in 2017.  Let's see you come up with as many examples where tanks saved lives.

I'll wait.

You screwed the pooch, maniac man. You type way faster than you read.

Here's the thing... If you hire 3 bodyguards for your safety you wouldn't want them saving their life instead on yours in a emergency.. You'd want the opposite.. It's the same thing here.
Besides, life is sacred, nobody has the right to just take it from someone, people are against death penalty but don't mind cops killing people? Hypocrisy.