People are allways a variable in our problems equations , why would some of you guys point that out it's not like we can eradicate them , in reality you need to work with the other variables to solve the problem, in this case guns.

(February 15, 2018 at 7:46 am)notimportant1234 Wrote: People are allways a variable in our problems equations , why would some of you guys point that out it's not like we can eradicate them , in reality you need to work with the other variables to solve the problem, in this case guns.

We shouldn't eradicate the gun nuts? Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing your post, not enough coffee I guess. 

If I'm correct then I can say that we'll always have fanatics of some ilk around, true.

The problem is we can't find them in time , so we aproach the variables that we can in order to solve the problem. Prevention is almost imposible when in comes to finding people before they do such a thing.

(February 15, 2018 at 8:06 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(February 15, 2018 at 7:46 am)notimportant1234 Wrote: People are allways a variable in our problems equations , why would some of you guys point that out it's not like we can eradicate them , in reality you need to work with the other variables to solve the problem, in this case guns.

We shouldn't eradicate the gun nuts? Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing your post, not enough coffee I guess. 

If I'm correct then I can say that we'll always have fanatics of some ilk around, true.

Yes, and those fanatics are literally giving more rights to an object than human lives.

(February 15, 2018 at 8:14 am)notimportant1234 Wrote: The problem is we can't find them in time , so we aproach the variables that we can in order to solve the problem. Prevention is almost imposible when in comes to finding people before they do such a thing.

It's a hard problem with no easy solution, I agree. But we have to work at it or things will only get worse.

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(February 15, 2018 at 8:19 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(February 15, 2018 at 8:06 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: We shouldn't eradicate the gun nuts? Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing your post, not enough coffee I guess. 

If I'm correct then I can say that we'll always have fanatics of some ilk around, true.

Yes, and those fanatics are literally giving more rights to an object than human lives.

I believe they are claiming rights above and beyond any rational need. They're hyperfocused, like the guys who blow up abortion clinics.

(February 14, 2018 at 4:10 pm)Lutrinae Wrote: These shootings keep happening, but apparently guns still aren't the problem.

It's a combination of mental illness and guns. regulation to keep the mentally ill from getting a gun should be a thing.

(February 15, 2018 at 4:53 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(February 14, 2018 at 9:09 pm)A Theist Wrote: Sure. They could be just as much to blame as anything else for what's going on. We've created a culture of violence here through Hollywood and video games including other media sources. This goes way beyond a gun control issue when a kid can take it in his heart and mind to go out and commit murder.

There were also movies that glorified violence through guns, knives, bombs, axes, etc. which have all been used in actual killings. Don't know about the anvil thing you watched on 1000s of Looney Tune cartoons, though.

It is true that there is a culture of violence.
Magazines on guns, movies, tv series and whatnot.... all available to underage kids.
Meanwhile, showing a female nipple is immediate cause for censoring and, if such censoring fails, immediate outrage from everywhere.

Back when I was younger, a teen, there were these German tv channels that would broadcast slightly erotic movies at their 11pm (my 10pm hehe), on Fridays (and maybe Saturdays - my memory is fuzzy). They were out in the open, free channels. And the next day, in the morning, the same channels would give us kids cartoons. and then news and whatever... I don't know if they still do that... but, with the internet, there might not be a demand for those movies.
In the more conservative Portugal, they showed a program that came from Italy... Colpo grosso, with the "ragazze cin cin" (damn that brunette in red was hot!)
Anyway, my point is that there's nothing inherently wrong in showing some titties on tv... but there seems to be a problem with it.
However, showing violent movies like Rambo or Commando (you can tell I'm old skool), those are ok.

"Make love, not war" is a motto that died in the the 70's, huh?


Still, no matter how motivated one is, without easy access to weapons, this sort of shootings would never happen.
And there is easy access in the states due to "historical reasons". Well, at some point, "historical reasons" has to stop being a reason for kids to die or be put in constant danger.
Metal detectors at every school?! at every public office?! That's something that makes no sense to my european mentality. The US is not a war zone... but it sure feels like one.

It doesn't have to be that way, but it will require a massive shift in the mentality of the whole population and that requires political willpower.
How much of the 2018 budget to the "armed forces" would it take to buy back all privately owned firearms in the country?

Here's a couple of experts debating whether or not if violence and pornography can have an effect on certain people to act out on their fantasies. One says yes. The other says no.









I don't think either of these two used guns to murder their victims, if memory serves me correctly. I can still remember when these killers were making headlines. Bundy clubbed his victims to death and then had sex with their corpses until they were too decomposed and Manson ordered his devotees to commit the murders of Sharon Tate and friends. Different methods of killing from those who murdered their victims with guns, but the same intent to commit murder. Gun control advocates can argue and politicize the issue all they want but it still doesn't address why anyone would even think to murder another person, what are the motives and what are the influences, and how are they going to control all the illegal and unknown weapons that are still in the hands of criminals. What prompted this kid to murder 17 of his classmates? Would there still have been these murders without the motive and the influence?

Would there still have been 17 murders and 17 injured in a matter of minutes if this kid didn't have access to an AR-15?

Boru

(February 15, 2018 at 10:05 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Would there still have been 17 murders and 17 injured in a matter of minutes if this kid didn't have access to an AR-15?

Boru

Would there still have been 17 murders and 17 injured if this kid wasn't intent on murdering people? You can argue the gun control issue all you want, if there was no motive or intent to kill there wouldn't have been 17 murders at that school. You focus on the guns but you ignore the weightier issue of why a person would even want to commit murder in the first place and what may have influenced that person. It was also reported that the kid had watched you tube videos on how to make bombs.

(February 15, 2018 at 11:11 am)A Theist Wrote:

(February 15, 2018 at 10:05 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Would there still have been 17 murders and 17 injured in a matter of minutes if this kid didn't have access to an AR-15?

Boru

Would there still have been 17 murders and 17 injured if this kid wasn't intent on murdering people? You can argue the gun control issue all you want, if there was no motive or intent to kill there wouldn't have been 17 murders at that school. You focus on the guns but you ignore the weightier issue of why a person would even want to commit murder in the first place and what may have influenced that person. It was also reported that the kid had watched you tube videos on how to make bombs.

So, did he make bombs? Nope. He went the easiest route for specific lethality. 

In short the US needs a massive overhaul in gun law. It all comes down to limiting access. The harder you make it the less guns will be seen as an option if killing humans is the intent.  

Also, this kid had a history, yet very little was done to help him or restrict him.