(March 21, 2018 at 7:42 pm)SaStrike Wrote: The angel Gabriel visited them in a cave.

Perhaps Angel Moroni told them to look in their head coverings and showed them a documentary movie.

I think different bunches of people were asked about Jesus' early life, and then the authors concocted their respective nativity stories based on what they were told.

Read Luke 1:1-4 for some elaboration:

1 Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.

(March 21, 2018 at 7:50 pm)Grandizer Wrote: I think different bunches of people were asked about Jesus' early life, and then the authors concocted their respective nativity stories based on what they were told.

Read Luke 1:1-4 for some elaboration:

1 Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.

Ok! Hearsay then!

Most of it would have to be, but that's not the biggest problem considering the limitations of the people writing the accounts.  They could go through existing roman records to learn of a census....using the earlier example..but there were no such records for jesus childhood so they would have worked with what sources they had.

So, we think Jesus, age 2, is looking at someone, sneezes, and that person changes into a newt or something ??

How does God Power work in the body of a 2 year old ??

Did Jesus masturbate ??

Was Jesus molesterated by a temple denizen ??

Did Jesus eat his vegetables ??

Did Jesus ever get sick ??

Did Jesus ever give the Virgin Mary that 'look' that would have made her blush ??

Did Joseph pretend to see a resemblance between himself and his kid ??

What did Joseph and Mary do with the gold ?? The myrrh ?? The frankincense ??

Did Jesus have BO ?? Parasites ?? Tonsils ?? How'd his bar mitzvah go ?? Did they really save his amniotic fluid ??

(March 21, 2018 at 7:50 pm)Grandizer Wrote: I think different bunches of people were asked about Jesus' early life, and then the authors concocted their respective nativity stories based on what they were told.

Asked by whom?

This is the problem with the Eusebian bullshit history of the church.  There is no indication that there was any regular contact between scattered groups who later came to be known as xtians.  There is no evidence that there was any overarching doctrine.  Instead we are asked to believe that all these "heresies" arose in the short period of time between the alleged crucifixion and 185 when Irenaeus wrote a book denouncing them.  Epiphanius refers to 80 such heresies.  I counted 25 in Book I ( of 5) in Irenaeus before I lost interest.

So, according to the "gospels" a bunch of the disciples went out into the world in the immediate aftermath of the alleged crucifixion to spread the word and they did such a shit job of it that a century later the entire message had fragmented?  What did the people they spoke to say to them?  "Fuck off?"

Far more likely that jesusism was just another mystery cult, isolated from other devotees, and spreading slowly throughout the Hellenistic East.  Later, when they attained the power to do so, the church mucky-mucks said " hey, you're a heretic and if you don't do what I say I'll have the emperor run you through. "

Far more reasonable.

Yeah they could have gathered bio on Jesus early years if his family cooperated, but as we know his mother and siblings did not believe in him and Jesus denounced them.

And although Mary was inserted as being at the crucifixion she and the rest of Christ family immediately and completely vanish into thin air after the Gospels. Mary is never mentioned again. She never says or does anything, is never spoken to or heard of again, and nothing ever happens to her. We aren't even told when or where she lived or died. She literally disappears from history--as if she never existed. All of his brothers disappear, not to mention sisters. They are never mentioned again. Generations later, two of them will have epistles written in their names. But according to Acts, they had no role at all to play in the history of the Church, and are never heard from. No one even seems to be aware they exist.

Jesus' father Joseph gets even less mention; having already disappeared from the story years ago, while Jesus was still a pre-teen.

Well, you know.  He did his bit.

(March 21, 2018 at 8:51 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

(March 21, 2018 at 7:50 pm)Grandizer Wrote: I think different bunches of people were asked about Jesus' early life, and then the authors concocted their respective nativity stories based on what they were told.

Asked by whom?

This is the problem with the Eusebian bullshit history of the church.  There is no indication that there was any regular contact between scattered groups who later came to be known as xtians.  There is no evidence that there was any overarching doctrine.  Instead we are asked to believe that all these "heresies" arose in the short period of time between the alleged crucifixion and 185 when Irenaeus wrote a book denouncing them.  Epiphanius refers to 80 such heresies.  I counted 25 in Book I ( of 5) in Irenaeus before I lost interest.

So, according to the "gospels" a bunch of the disciples went out into the world in the immediate aftermath of the alleged crucifixion to spread the word and they did such a shit job of it that a century later the entire message had fragmented?  What did the people they spoke to say to them?  "Fuck off?"

Far more likely that jesusism was just another mystery cult, isolated from other devotees, and spreading slowly throughout the Hellenistic East.  Later, when they attained the power to do so, the church mucky-mucks said " hey, you're a heretic and if you don't do what I say I'll have the emperor run you through. "

Far more reasonable.

It's a known thing with religions that a prophet gets no cred in his home town. There's a reason for that- the locals know he's crazy.

Not to mention that the evidence for his hometown is, at best, slim.