(September 4, 2011 at 9:01 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 3:54 am)coffeeveritas Wrote: A disproportionate majority of people masturbate with at least some frequency (numbers are in the 90-95% range for both genders in some demographics). Obviously it's a problem to be addicted to porn, or compulsively masturbate, but some Christian ethicists (such as Lew Smedes) would say that otherwise whether or not to masturbate is up to the individual. (The Bible says to "love thyself" right?).

How do you mean disproportionate?.

I would suggest that not only is masturbation normal but indeed necessary for your mental well being(specially if you're a bloke).

And how can you NOT compulsively masturbate if you're a teenage boy?

Oh for sure, that's pretty much what the psychological literature says. I agree, it's normal. I was saying disproportionate in that it is not a close majority, like 51%, but much higher. As in, the amount of people who do masturbate is a much higher proportion than don't. Basically the statistics show that pretty much everyone has masturbated, so it's kind of stupid to act like it's something shameful that no one can talk about.

(September 4, 2011 at 6:15 pm)Welsh cake Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 1:07 pm)Castle Wrote: Why should I doctor up, a Christian quote, that’s their problem. I can avoid sin baggage by adjusting my own mistakes.

If you intend to quote another person's work or paraphrase their statements entirely in future, will you kindly add quotation marks and then cite or reference them to avoid plagiarising.

http://www.newjerusalem.com/bepure.htm

This way, I can avoid responding to parrots regurgitating someone else's vomit.

I did say this is the chick part, relating to the first part of my first post.
I guess I take for granted after telling people I am not religious. I can see how things can get mix up without quotation..

For the sake of being clearer, I will use quotation marks next time. Thank you

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(September 4, 2011 at 7:50 pm)coffeeveritas Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 9:01 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 3:54 am)coffeeveritas Wrote: A disproportionate majority of people masturbate with at least some frequency (numbers are in the 90-95% range for both genders in some demographics). Obviously it's a problem to be addicted to porn, or compulsively masturbate, but some Christian ethicists (such as Lew Smedes) would say that otherwise whether or not to masturbate is up to the individual. (The Bible says to "love thyself" right?).

How do you mean disproportionate?.

I would suggest that not only is masturbation normal but indeed necessary for your mental well being(specially if you're a bloke).

And how can you NOT compulsively masturbate if you're a teenage boy?

Oh for sure, that's pretty much what the psychological literature says. I agree, it's normal. I was saying disproportionate in that it is not a close majority, like 51%, but much higher. As in, the amount of people who do masturbate is a much higher proportion than don't. Basically the statistics show that pretty much everyone has masturbated, so it's kind of stupid to act like it's something shameful that no one can talk about.

In fact masturbation is physically and mentally healthy for us. If Men do not release them self, they can cause prostate cancer and other kind of physical problems. Or Other mentally monstrous sexual act for example can be like when clergymen go out and molest little children

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(September 4, 2011 at 5:00 pm)coffeeveritas Wrote: Where is it written that God lives in the dark? He's usually described as the "Father of Heavenly Lights", or the "light of the world" or something.

But you are right when you say that many Christians are in the dark on a lot of sexual issues. Actually America as a country is not very sexually healthy, we have a lot of fear and angst surrounding sexuality (I wouldn't say it's ALL the churches fault, but man did we chip in on that one). It's really hard to do, but the church and the country at large has to learn to accept that we are sexual beings, and that being sexual is a natural and good part of life, not something to be afraid of.

God lives in Darkness - 1 Kings 8:12, 2 Chronicles 6:1 Peter 4:19, Psalm 18:11, Isaiah 45:3, Lamentations 3:2, Exodus 20:21, 1 Kings 8:12, ...

Why do they not teach Christian masturbation is natural? Why are they so freak out it about it, mind you I found out a few atheist here that were freaked out about it too.

When will their big head start teach the little head how healthy it is rather than how it is a sin, but you won’t find that in your good book.

(September 4, 2011 at 8:59 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

So you should embrace fate and just screw your mom yourself.

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(September 4, 2011 at 1:07 pm)Castle Wrote: Avatar your thing, "What we have here is a failure to communicate,"

Think about it this way... every time you post something without an avatar.... this is what you look like:



Whereas people with avatars have faces and are people

(You don't get to be a person until you get an avatar)

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(September 4, 2011 at 4:14 pm)thesummerqueen Wrote: Putting your song theories to the test, btw, Rhythm.

What are the preliminary results?

I think it's a sin because it's really hard to masturbate while thinking of Jesus at the same time. (Unless it's Jesus porn, which is clearly the best kind.)

(September 4, 2011 at 7:57 pm)Castle Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 7:50 pm)coffeeveritas Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 9:01 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(September 4, 2011 at 3:54 am)coffeeveritas Wrote: A disproportionate majority of people masturbate with at least some frequency (numbers are in the 90-95% range for both genders in some demographics). Obviously it's a problem to be addicted to porn, or compulsively masturbate, but some Christian ethicists (such as Lew Smedes) would say that otherwise whether or not to masturbate is up to the individual. (The Bible says to "love thyself" right?).

How do you mean disproportionate?.

I would suggest that not only is masturbation normal but indeed necessary for your mental well being(specially if you're a bloke).

And how can you NOT compulsively masturbate if you're a teenage boy?

Oh for sure, that's pretty much what the psychological literature says. I agree, it's normal. I was saying disproportionate in that it is not a close majority, like 51%, but much higher. As in, the amount of people who do masturbate is a much higher proportion than don't. Basically the statistics show that pretty much everyone has masturbated, so it's kind of stupid to act like it's something shameful that no one can talk about.

In fact masturbation is physically and mentally healthy for us. If Men do not release them self, they can cause prostate cancer and other kind of physical problems. Or Other mentally monstrous sexual act for example can be like when clergymen go out and molest little children

I worry that I may have been unclear, what I was saying is:
A.) Virtually everyone has masturbated, so it's like it is some dark secret.
B.) Masturbating is not really a problem, unless it's some sort of addiction.
C.) Therefore there are Christians ethicists who would say that whether or not to masturbate is totally up to the individual person.

This stance comes out to be neutral on the subject, but I would be willing to go farther to say that we need to teach about sex and masturbation in a way that destigmatizes it so people don't have to feel shame and guilt about their sexuality.

As far as lack of masturbation leading to sexual abuse, that one is not consistent with the psychological literature. Typically a sexual predator will go through a phase of compulsive masturbation and fantasy about their target before they ever actually assault someone. That's why compulsive masturbation (as defined by the APA) is not good, it's actually a precursor to some more outrageous and even criminal sexual behaviors (because it's a symptom of sexual addiction).

(September 4, 2011 at 7:57 pm)Castle Wrote:

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(September 4, 2011 at 5:00 pm)coffeeveritas Wrote: Where is it written that God lives in the dark? He's usually described as the "Father of Heavenly Lights", or the "light of the world" or something.

But you are right when you say that many Christians are in the dark on a lot of sexual issues. Actually America as a country is not very sexually healthy, we have a lot of fear and angst surrounding sexuality (I wouldn't say it's ALL the churches fault, but man did we chip in on that one). It's really hard to do, but the church and the country at large has to learn to accept that we are sexual beings, and that being sexual is a natural and good part of life, not something to be afraid of.

God lives in Darkness - 1 Kings 8:12, 2 Chronicles 6:1 Peter 4:19, Psalm 18:11, Isaiah 45:3, Lamentations 3:2, Exodus 20:21, 1 Kings 8:12, ...

Why do they not teach Christian masturbation is natural? Why are they so freak out it about it, mind you I found out a few atheist here that were freaked out about it too.

When will their big head start teach the little head how healthy it is rather than how it is a sin, but you won’t find that in your good book.

Yes, I totally agree about the need for a more mature discussion about sexuality. I would like to see the church talk about masturbation as be normal rather than dangerous. For sure you want to avoid any sexual behaviors that would be classified as maladaptive by the DSM, but short of that it's not really a problem. Many times when I talk to other Christians about sexuality they are squeamish, but I always remind them that there is a big book of erotic poetry in the middle of the Bible (one of my favorite facts).

As far as God dwelling in the darkness, I couldn't think of what you were talking about, but when you mentioned those verses I finally did recall. I know about a few scattered verses that mention God in the darkness, but it seemed like you were appealing to a motif. The one you brought up is actually a really cool Hebrew way of talking about God. Specifically the darkness refers to smoke and clouds, which God was thought to inhabit from time to time. There's actually a lot of poetry behind that particular use of the word; it has a sort of haunting beauty. Still, it's not a very common way of referring to God now-a-days, where did you come across it?

So people don't feel shame or guilt about their sexuality? I believe that song and dance began in the first chapter of a certain holy book (according to some). Hell, if the bible were a road you couldn't throw a pebble without hitting some derogatory reference to sexuality. It's such a problem, apparently, that attempts have been made to translate it right out of the song of songs, which is, from start to finish, about an illicit love affair. I understand your position, and I agree with you. Masturbation is normal. It is morally neutral. That doesn't mean that this is the position that can be extracted from scripture. Asking a group of believers to side with a position that is contrary to their revealed word is to ask them to expose their religious belief for exactly what it is. Selective interpretation of ambiguity or outright absurdity in text.

(September 4, 2011 at 7:50 pm)coffeeveritas Wrote: Yes, I totally agree about the need for a more mature discussion about sexuality. I would like to see the church talk about masturbation as be normal rather than dangerous. For sure you want to avoid any sexual behaviors that would be classified as maladaptive by the DSM, but short of that it's not really a problem. Many times when I talk to other Christians about sexuality they are squeamish, but I always remind them that there is a big book of erotic poetry in the middle of the Bible (one of my favorite facts).

As far as God dwelling in the darkness, I couldn't think of what you were talking about, but when you mentioned those verses I finally did recall. I know about a few scattered verses that mention God in the darkness, but it seemed like you were appealing to a motif. The one you brought up is actually a really cool Hebrew way of talking about God. Specifically the darkness refers to smoke and clouds, which God was thought to inhabit from time to time. There's actually a lot of poetry behind that particular use of the word; it has a sort of haunting beauty. Still, it's not a very common way of referring to God now-a-days, where did you come across it?

Please help these slow leaning Christian towards the light. It took time too long for them to find out about dinosaurs and that the world was not flat. Lets save them from getting hairy palms, blindness, or go insane from spanking the monkey.

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