(July 7, 2018 at 4:38 pm)chimp3 Wrote: I have read the Koran twice. Translation by Abdullah Yusef Ali. That is why I left the Chisti Sufi order. The Koran is as violent as the Judeo-Christian Babble. If we want a peaceful world we need to leave this Bronze Aged bullshit behind and start asking what really will produce a peaceful world. The Abrahamic religions have overwhelmingly proved themselves incapable.

Looking at the world; violence is pretty much the answer preferred by humans to keep on the peace; don't forget that the current state of "relative peace" is very fragile, and only kept by the power of nuclear deterrence that followed WW2, it's more of a "time-out" between the rounds in a boxing match. And it's not religion that is going to burn the fuels of war again, but economy will.

Humans are obviously meant to fight and won't stop until earth is a piece of coal. I don't see Allah responsible for that, but I see secular order that only makes sense in a nationalist forest-like world as the cause; the main responsible cause.

A situation that everybody could've avoided if charity was given, mothers were respected, corruption was ended, killing was punished, stealing was punished, adultery was punished, wars were ended against the innocent.

The Quran is advocating peace in so many verses; I can quote them for you.

(July 7, 2018 at 7:52 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(July 7, 2018 at 4:38 pm)chimp3 Wrote: I have read the Koran twice. Translation by Abdullah Yusef Ali. That is why I left the Chisti Sufi order. The Koran is as violent as the Judeo-Christian Babble. If we want a peaceful world we need to leave this Bronze Aged bullshit behind and start asking what really will produce a peaceful world. The Abrahamic religions have overwhelmingly proved themselves incapable.

Looking at the world; violence is pretty much the answer preferred by humans to keep on the peace; don't forget that the current state of "relative peace" is very fragile, and only kept by the power of nuclear deterrence that followed WW2, it's more of a "time-out" between the rounds in a boxing match. And it's not religion that is going to burn the fuels of war again, but economy will.

Humans are obviously meant to fight and won't stop until earth is a piece of coal. I don't see Allah responsible for that, but I see secular order that only makes sense in a nationalist forest-like world as the cause; the main responsible cause.

A situation that everybody could've avoided if charity was given, mothers were respected, corruption was ended, killing was punished, stealing was punished, adultery was punished, wars were ended against the innocent.

The Quran is advocating peace in so many verses; I can quote them for you.

If humans are meant to fight then who meant that to be?

Man is greedy and that is why we will never have peace on this planet. Because person A must always out do person B because person A is jealous and must win at all costs. Person A must always be richer, better, smarter than person B. And instead of just minding their own damn business, person A goes on a mission to be "The Best" at all costs. Others see this and either take that as a challenge or think person A is just a fool to be ignored. However, the narcissist in person A cannot stand being ignored, therefore they swear everyone is their enemy and thus begins the start of person A's need to get The Man. "To hell with being nice! I must show "society" what their place is, for they are beneath me and I must make them tow the line! "

And so the hatred for one another begins.

(July 7, 2018 at 7:52 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: The Quran is advocating peace in so many verses; I can quote them for you.

The irony of scripture, no matter the religion, is that just as many verses advocating peace can be found as those advocating discord.

(July 7, 2018 at 7:24 pm)ReptilianPeon Wrote:

(July 7, 2018 at 5:01 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Categories 2 and 3 have a fair amount of overlap, lol.

But if they are true believers then they must not be extremists necessarily? Are you suggesting that violence is normal? If so, then wouldn't the extremists be the peaceful ones, like Atlas actually. I'm a bit confused.

The people are confusing, the phenomenon isn;t.  Extremists live at the fringe of [whatever they think magic book is saying to them.  

-but yeah..violence is normal for human beings, in many ways, many forms. Never make the mistake of thinking that you have a "peaceful" true believer...... of -anything-....... on your hands. You just haven;t crossed their lines yet, or they haven;t.

You can see his trapdoor already. "Deter aggression". We here in the land of the great satan call that a preemptive strike. A longer view of history and human behavior calls it pretext.

Any time you use religion(s) as a justification for any action(s)...................... you're wrong.