Of course we have the whole problem of god's plan versus the supposed agency of humans (we'll leave our other animals for simplicity).

Do we have the power to cause events to change from god's plan? Again, each answer is problematic.

If we don't, then we're just part of a theatre. We're not having any effect at all that wasn't scripted for us. If we do, then God has no plan after all, at best he can guess at what is going to happen; or else he constantly screws with things to negate any change we're actually making, although even that is a stretch as an explanation.

Anyhow, if we do have the power to change his plans, I suppose prayer could be asking him to screw with other people so that they do stuff to make whatever you want happen. That only works for prayers that can be accomplished this way though. It's not going to stop any hurricanes.

(September 18, 2018 at 12:16 pm)Drich Wrote: the book does not give instructions on how to do it.. stupid people make up their own rituals that have nothing to do with what is written. IT says nothing about not usings safe snake handling tools, or gloves or even a snare pole. is it stupid to handle a snake with the proper tools? the bible does not say they can not be used. it just says people can pick up poisonous snakes. Fools who persume to know the mind of God are the ones who think God is going to cast a spell on them or the snake... no where does it say that and they deserve to be bitten and die for putting those words in God's mouth.

Can i pickup a poisonous snake? I have with a snare pole and gloves. I also picked one up with out any of that, but I had removed it's head with a shovel first. again the bible doesn't say you can't do that. People fill in their own blanks and pretend it is the word of God. this is the exact opposite of what I do and try and teach you all from doing here.

Lol.

Take it up with your fellow believers.

(September 18, 2018 at 12:37 pm)Drich Wrote: Looking back on how you shifted from snake handling to religious denial of medical care I doubt truth is anywhere on your mapp.

Yeah, like you're looking for truth. I didn't shift anything, this is what I said for what NC & you were asking me citations

Quote:Even today, Americans are dying because these verses are in the Bible. Unfortunately, all too often children pay the price for their parents' stupidity.

But, hey, I understand: you are a Christian you need to lie to yourself.

(September 18, 2018 at 12:54 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote:

(September 18, 2018 at 12:37 pm)Drich Wrote: Looking back on how you shifted from snake handling to religious denial of medical care I doubt truth is anywhere on your mapp.

Yeah, like you're looking for truth. I didn't shift anything, this is what I said for what NC & you were asking me citations

Quote:Even today, Americans are dying because these verses are in the Bible. Unfortunately, all too often children pay the price for their parents' stupidity.

But, hey, I understand: you are a Christian you need to lie to yourself.

You were exclusively talking about snake handlers dying in droves. you were asked to prove it by neo.. you belittle him for asking for a citation then I asked for one like 2 or 3 times then you produced so bs concerning death citing religious negligence! which is BS because I also cited similar death due to holistic lifestyles and holistic medicines over modern drugs and vaccines. then tie the commonality of certain people who will use whatever excuse not to participate in modern medcine no matter what they believe about god.

(September 14, 2018 at 11:06 pm)robvalue Wrote: They still consider “no I won’t” to be an answer from god, and they instinctively know that this will always be the answer if they wish for anything outside the mundane (that could happen anyway).

That ain't what fucking 'jesus' said.... according to their own Holy Horseshit.

Quote: 21 And Jesus answered them, “Truly, I say to you, if you have faith and do not doubt, you will not only do what has been done to the fig tree, but even if you say to this mountain, ‘Be taken up and thrown into the sea,’ it will happen. 22 And whatever you ask in prayer, you will receive, if you have faith.”

Matty  21

Of course you have to be a complete asshole to fall for that but plenty of xhristards are!

(September 18, 2018 at 12:01 pm)Crossless2.0 Wrote: ...but it is pretty fucking stupid to handle poisonous snakes because an old book tells you that you can.

I agree. And it smacks of putting the Lord to a test. The text says that it might happen to someone sometime in the future. It doesn't say "go grab ya some rattlers".

(September 18, 2018 at 12:01 pm)Crossless2.0 Wrote:

(September 18, 2018 at 11:46 am)Drich Wrote: so 14 people in 70+ years...

Isn't that a far cry from fakers claim of people dying all the time? more people died in the last hurricane by almost double. why make such a dubious claim?

It wasn't my claim. Yes, it's a far cry from "mountains" of deaths, but it is pretty fucking stupid to handle poisonous snakes because an old book tells you that you can.

Especially as that passage was added centuries later by some nameless scribe because he thought ( correctly) that "mark" needed a better ending.  Xtians are so loose with their scripture one might almost think of it as diarrhea.

(September 18, 2018 at 12:37 pm)Drich Wrote: So NO! YOU CAN NOT CHANGE GOD'S PLAN, you conform to it.

So a theatre then, got it.

Welcome to “It’s God’s Way Anyway” the reality where everything is pre-determined and the actions don’t matter.