(November 13, 2018 at 2:34 am)Everena Wrote: I was raised by atheists and that is one of the reasons I feel comfortable having discussions with atheists. Your logic is faulty though and it is my opinion that you have been brainwashed by some fairly mean spirited folks who want you to fear death.

Everena, I do not appreciate it when a total stranger calls us brainwashed, blind, or any other combination of words that implies that you have some blatantly obvious knowledge that we simply refuse to accept.  Do you honestly believe that we were never exposed to the stuff you're pushing?  That we never thought about it?  You're wrong.  We've thought about it a lot, some of us for decades.

Furthermore, I think it's counterproductive for you, or anyone else, to use the word "know" when presenting a worldview.  Call it belief and I have no problem with that.  I can easily accept that people believe things that I don't.   The moment you say "I know..." you have presented an unsupported assertion.  You have crossed from faith to alleged knowledge, and I for one want to see evidence.  Empirical evidence, something that I could have analyzed in a laboratory if I so desire.  Evidence that meets my standards, not yours.

Finally, you seem to be so "comfortable" that you think nothing of insulting us.  You're painting a rather unflattering picture of you and your beliefs.  Could I perhaps convince you to apologize and then to desist from that particular behaviour?

(November 12, 2018 at 6:45 pm)unfogged Wrote:

(November 12, 2018 at 4:36 pm)Everena Wrote: Why would we have a sex drive and want to procreate? Just for no reason?

We have a sex drive because it was stumbled into during the evolutionary process and it had  positive effect for species survival.  You keep assuming there is an intent behind everything.  There's no justification or need for that.

Everena: It was stumbled into? Are you kidding? We have genitals and males and females can reproduce and you are seriously going to pretend that we just stumpled into our sex drive? Did we trip over something when we were drunk and stumple into it? I mean, come on!

And we have reproductive organs so obviously there is a very incredibly important intent behind everything. Wake up!!!!

(November 12, 2018 at 4:40 pm)Everena Wrote: That is not a valid explanation for all the pain and suffering that exists in this world.

Actually, it is once you drop the unfounded assumption that there is intent behind events.

Quote:We have a goal to acheive here of becoming better people so we can be rewarded with eternity in paradise. As you know though, you can do anything you darn well please.

That is simply inane.  A god that wanted beings to live an eternty in paradise could just create that.  Setting up a "test" that lasts less than 100 years and providing no unambiguous instructions and considerable evidence that there is NO afterlife would be the work of an insane monster.

Everena: God did not create our true selves, we always have been and always will be. God created our flesh here. Obviously we are in serious need of improvement to deserving of  an eternal paradise and some much more than others.

(November 12, 2018 at 5:04 pm)Everena Wrote: I determined my explanation for pain and suffering by deciding on the only thing that would make this a fair and just universe. The fact that over a billion people in the world think so too was just an added bonus.

The idea that you want this to be a fair and just universe has zero bearing on whether or not it is a fair and just universe.  The evidence all points to it being a wholly uncaring universe and your refusal to accept that is entirely your loss.  You can accept it and work to make things better now or reject it and continue living in your fantasy world along with everybody else who is unwilling to face reality as it is.

Everena: I refuse to believe any unfair, unjust, cold, cruel world theory.

(November 12, 2018 at 5:10 pm)Everena Wrote: You should believe whatever makes the most sense to you and if that makes sense to you, so be it.

You should believe whatever the actual evidence supports, not what makes you feel good.

(November 12, 2018 at 5:13 pm)Everena Wrote: We only suffer through pain that we have intentionally caused to others in this life or in past lives, and especially to our other half/soulmate since they are the ones we can damage the most.  

There's zero credible evidence of past lives.

Everena: That is not true at all. There is a ton of credible evidence from Dr Ian Stevenson alone.

Quote:I refuse to believe in an unfair and unjust cold, cruel universe theory. Sorry, that explanation will never make any sense to me.

"So the universe is not quite as you thought it was. You’d better rearrange your beliefs, then. Because you certainly can’t rearrange the universe." -- Isaac Asimov

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(November 12, 2018 at 7:18 pm)Astreja Wrote:

(November 12, 2018 at 7:03 pm)Everena Wrote: Even if they are, it does not explain why {plants} would all be here to feed us unless it was because of GOD...

Evolution explains it very simply.

Organisms that ate unhealthy or poisonous plants did not live to reproduce.

Organisms favouring plants that are both healthy and good-tasting would eat those instead.  They would have more energy to fight off or run from predators, they would live to reproductive age, their offspring would continue to select beneficial plants for food, and are the survivors and our ancestors.

Evolution is a human made term used to describe a process that we discovered was happening. It does not explain the first cause of anything including food. So no, that does not explain why we have food on this planet for the approx 7.8 million different species of conscious life.

Everena you said that your from USA. Do you live in a rich state?

(November 12, 2018 at 11:58 am)Everena Wrote:

(November 12, 2018 at 11:51 am)IWNKYAAIMI Wrote: Nobody in their right mind could choose to believe.. It needs to be hammered home from an early age.

That is not true. I was raised by atheist/agnostic.

That makes you the exception rather than the rule..

As I said above, Everena, the evidence has to meet my standards. I do not find any past-life tales believable.

I work in a hospital. Among other things, I type reports for neurologists. I know a bit about EEGs. Personality and awareness are expressed when we are conscious. At such times the brain is comparatively active (for instance in the beta frequency range). As waves slow down to gamma and then delta, we become drowsy and then lose consciousness. If the frequency of the waves drops to zero and stays there, we are dead.

If we can't retain awareness or a sense of self in stage IV delta wave sleep, with the brain generating frequencies of only 1-2 Hz, what do you suppose happens at a frequency of 0 Hz?

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(November 13, 2018 at 3:10 am)Everena Wrote: Evolution is a human made term used to describe a process that we discovered was happening. It does not explain the first cause of anything including food. So no, that does not explain why we have food on this planet for the approx 7.8 million different species of conscious life.

Keep telling yourself that, Everena, if you must. Go make offerings to the frigging Sandwich Faeries if it makes you happy.

But don't fucking pretend that you understand biology, okay?

Quote:That's fantastic. No one is saying evolution is not true. We are saying the complex code of DNA did not create itself.

Creationists say it's not . DNA is chemistry and it was formed by chemistry not magic nonsense .

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Quote:That is not true. I was raised by atheist/agnostic.

Which does not alter the facts

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Quote:Evolution is a human made term used to describe a process that we discovered was happening

Evolution is the process 

Quote: It does not explain the first cause of anything including food. 

Yes it does 

Quote:So no, that does not explain why we have food on this planet for the approx 7.8 million different species of conscious life.

Yes it does

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And even if didn't . GOD DONE IT . isn't an answer .

(November 13, 2018 at 3:10 am)Everena Wrote: Evolution is a human made term used to describe a process that we discovered was happening. It does not explain the first cause of anything including food. So no, that does not explain why we have food on this planet for the approx 7.8 million different species of conscious life.

You'll be telling us that God made perfectly shaped bananas for us next.

(November 12, 2018 at 5:13 pm)Everena Wrote:

(November 12, 2018 at 5:09 pm)Khemikal Wrote: So, rather than actually investigate pain or suffering or their causes, you made yet another illogical leap into hilarity?

Perhaps you should have considered, even in that..at least for a monemt, that the universe is not fair or just..just as you may have at least taken a second to consider that there may be no natural force that gives a shit about your love, sex drive, and survival?

We only suffer through pain that we have intentionally caused to others in this life or in past lives, and especially to our other half/soulmate since they are the ones we can damage the most.  I refuse to believe in an unfair and unjust cold, cruel universe theory. Sorry, that explanation will never make any sense to me.

So children who suffer and die in, say, war, or through a terminal illness, only have themselves to blame?

Looks like you’re the one who is cold and cruel, not to mention totally sick and abhorrent, and a troll.

If your beliefs are the key to ‘eternal life’, then leave us out. None of us could be so intellectually dishonest, or so mentally vacant, as to deceive and degrade ourselves to the level you have. You have sacrificed your humanity for a lie, and you’ll never get it back. Gutted for you, I guess.

Quote:We only suffer through pain that we have intentionally caused to others in this life or in past lives, and especially to our other half/soulmate since they are the ones we can damage the most.  I refuse to believe in an unfair and unjust cold, cruel universe theory. Sorry, that explanation will never make any sense to me.

But a universe with a supposedly loving god who allows this is acceptable too you 
https://asylumeclectica.com/malady/archives/leprosy.htm

A god who eternally make victims and other people eternally guilty you consider that fair and just 

(November 13, 2018 at 3:37 am)IWNKYAAIMI Wrote:

(November 13, 2018 at 3:10 am)Everena Wrote: Evolution is a human made term used to describe a process that we discovered was happening. It does not explain the first cause of anything including food. So no, that does not explain why we have food on this planet for the approx 7.8 million different species of conscious life.

You'll be telling us that God made perfectly shaped bananas for us next.

He posted once here, you know. Ray whatahisface.

Can’t rememver the exact thread but it was on a thread discussing that infamous incident and I believe we managed to confirm it was him.