Once again, the "word" miracle is being used to describe the safe landing after a jet engine failure. NO, it was not a "miracle", it was pilot training and redundancy design in case of failure. If the plain had crashed and everyone had died would it still be called a "miracle"?





Now, I will say it was "amazing" that nobody on the ground was killed by the falling debris. But survival or death isn't a matter of magic, but mere conditions of many factors.

(February 21, 2021 at 12:36 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Once again, the "word" miracle is being used to describe the safe landing after a jet engine failure. NO, it was not a "miracle", it was pilot training and redundancy design in case of failure. If the plain had crashed and everyone had died would it still be called a "miracle"?





Now, I will say it was "amazing" that nobody on the ground was killed by the falling debris. But survival or death isn't a matter of magic, but mere conditions of many factors.

You are looking at the word miracle in one of the meanings...which implies something supernatural, as in a god.  There are other definitions.  

miracle
[color=var(--primtxt)][ˈmirək(ə)l]

[/color]
[color=var(--promtxt)]NOUN[/color]

1. [color=var(--promtxt)]a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.[/color]
   "the miracle of rising from the grave"
   [color=var(--primtxt)]synonyms:[/color]
   supernatural phenomenon · mystery · prodigy · sign
   • [color=var(--promtxt)]a highly improbable or extraordinary event, development, or accomplishment that brings very welcome consequences.[/color]
     "it was a miracle that more people hadn't been killed or injured"
     
   • [color=var(--promtxt)]an amazing product or achievement, or an outstanding example of something.[/color]
     "a machine which was a miracle of design" · 
     [color=var(--alinkcol)][more][/color]
     
     [color=var(--primtxt)]synonyms:[/color]
     wonder · marvel · sensation · [url=https://www.bing.com/search?q=define+phenomenon&FORM=DCTRQY&PC=HCTS][/url]
     

Check out "a highly improbable..." and "an amazing..."

Not godspeak.  

Some words have more than one meaning.  You can add that you language confusion.

Have a version of that without the nerdspeak?

I’m comfortable with word ‘miracle’ in common usage. It doesn’t necessarily have any more supernatural connotations than, ‘Oh, my god!.

Boru

(February 21, 2021 at 12:53 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Have a version of that without the nerdspeak?

Sure, I'll simplify it for you.


Definition of miracle


1: an extraordinary event  divine intervention in human affairs the healing miracles described in the Gospels

2: an extremely outstanding or unusual event, thing, or accomplishment The bridge is a miracle of engineering.

(February 21, 2021 at 12:48 pm)arewethereyet Wrote:

(February 21, 2021 at 12:36 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Once again, the "word" miracle is being used to describe the safe landing after a jet engine failure. NO, it was not a "miracle", it was pilot training and redundancy design in case of failure. If the plain had crashed and everyone had died would it still be called a "miracle"?





Now, I will say it was "amazing" that nobody on the ground was killed by the falling debris. But survival or death isn't a matter of magic, but mere conditions of many factors.

You are looking at the word miracle in one of the meanings...which implies something supernatural, as in a god.  There are other definitions.  

miracle
[color=var(--primtxt)][ˈmirək(ə)l]

[/color]
[color=var(--promtxt)]NOUN[/color]

1. [color=var(--promtxt)]a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.[/color]
   "the miracle of rising from the grave"
   [color=var(--primtxt)]synonyms:[/color]
   supernatural phenomenon · mystery · prodigy · sign
   • [color=var(--promtxt)]a highly improbable or extraordinary event, development, or accomplishment that brings very welcome consequences.[/color]
     "it was a miracle that more people hadn't been killed or injured"
     
   • [color=var(--promtxt)]an amazing product or achievement, or an outstanding example of something.[/color]
     "a machine which was a miracle of design" · 
     [color=var(--alinkcol)][more][/color]
     
     [color=var(--primtxt)]synonyms:[/color]
     wonder · marvel · sensation · [url=https://www.bing.com/search?q=define+phenomenon&FORM=DCTRQY&PC=HCTS][/url]
     

Check out "a highly improbable..." and "an amazing..."

Not godspeak.  

Some words have more than one meaning.  You can add that you language confusion.

The folks who invoke that word are not using it the way you are defining it. Most whom use this word mean it to be a god intervening.

It is the same as when the layperson doesn't know the meaning of "theory" in science and try to equate it to a mere guess.

If it is just "improbable" or "amazing" then just use those words. "Miracle" for me has simply too much superstitious baggage to be considered a valid explanation. It is intellectual laziness. Otherwise call it a "miracle" if it crashes and half survive and half die. 

Conditions of the pilots training and the redundancy built into the plane's design are why they landed safely. It was not a "miracle". 

A "miracle" would be if the plane went into helicopter hover when the plane isn't designed to hover. THAT would be a "miracle".

"Miracle" is a nonsense word. It is an an utterance after having an "oh shit" moment and being happy you didn't die. It isn't a word that explains anything. NTSB will investigate and find the answers.

(February 21, 2021 at 1:00 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(February 21, 2021 at 12:48 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: You are looking at the word miracle in one of the meanings...which implies something supernatural, as in a god.  There are other definitions.  

miracle
[color=var(--primtxt)][ˈmirək(ə)l]

[/color]
[color=var(--promtxt)]NOUN[/color]

1. [color=var(--promtxt)]a surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.[/color]
   "the miracle of rising from the grave"
   [color=var(--primtxt)]synonyms:[/color]
   supernatural phenomenon · mystery · prodigy · sign
   • [color=var(--promtxt)]a highly improbable or extraordinary event, development, or accomplishment that brings very welcome consequences.[/color]
     "it was a miracle that more people hadn't been killed or injured"
     
   • [color=var(--promtxt)]an amazing product or achievement, or an outstanding example of something.[/color]
     "a machine which was a miracle of design" · 
     [color=var(--alinkcol)][more][/color]
     
     [color=var(--primtxt)]synonyms:[/color]
     wonder · marvel · sensation · [url=https://www.bing.com/search?q=define+phenomenon&FORM=DCTRQY&PC=HCTS][/url]
     

Check out "a highly improbable..." and "an amazing..."

Not godspeak.  

Some words have more than one meaning.  You can add that you language confusion.

The folks who invoke that word are not using it the way you are defining it. Most whom use this word mean it to be a god intervening.

It is the same as when the layperson doesn't know the meaning of "theory" in science and try to equate it to a mere guess.

If it is just "improbable" or "amazing" then just use those words. "Miracle" for me has simply too much superstitious baggage to be considered a valid explanation. It is intellectual laziness. Otherwise call it a "miracle" if it crashes and half survive and half die. 

Conditions of the pilots training and the redundancy built into the plane's design are why they landed safely. It was not a "miracle". 

A "miracle" would be if the plane went into helicopter hover when the plane isn't designed to hover. THAT would be a "miracle".

"Miracle" is a nonsense word. It is an an utterance after having an "oh shit" moment and being happy you didn't die. It isn't a word that explains anything. NTSB will investigate and find the answers.

You don't know how people are using the word.

And how you understand it isn't the only way people use it.

(February 21, 2021 at 1:07 pm)arewethereyet Wrote:

(February 21, 2021 at 1:00 pm)Brian37 Wrote: The folks who invoke that word are not using it the way you are defining it. Most whom use this word mean it to be a god intervening.

It is the same as when the layperson doesn't know the meaning of "theory" in science and try to equate it to a mere guess.

If it is just "improbable" or "amazing" then just use those words. "Miracle" for me has simply too much superstitious baggage to be considered a valid explanation. It is intellectual laziness. Otherwise call it a "miracle" if it crashes and half survive and half die. 

Conditions of the pilots training and the redundancy built into the plane's design are why they landed safely. It was not a "miracle". 

A "miracle" would be if the plane went into helicopter hover when the plane isn't designed to hover. THAT would be a "miracle".

"Miracle" is a nonsense word. It is an an utterance after having an "oh shit" moment and being happy you didn't die. It isn't a word that explains anything. NTSB will investigate and find the answers.

You don't know how people are using the word.

And how you understand it isn't the only way people use it.

Not the point. I wouldn't assume everyone who uses isn't chalking it up to a magic sky daddy. 

Even if one is arguing your usage, it is still intellectual laziness. The real answers are going to be found in the NTSB investigation. "Miracle" isn't an explanation. It is a word used as an emotional reaction to stress and surviving that stress. 

If I had been on that plane, I damned sure would have been freaking out and shitting my pants. Just mere turbulence scares the shit out of me. But I would just simply say, "glad I didn't die" and be extremely happy I didn't die. But that is how I would put it.  That is simply one word I hate hearing being used after such events.

Clearly, this is a miracle. I mean if you discount the plane's engineering, the navigation systems onboard, The experienced pilot, and the property damage caused by the falling debris from the plane. What other explanation could there be?

Praise to FSM for guiding this plane safely.

(February 21, 2021 at 1:31 pm)Nay_Sayer Wrote: Clearly, this is a miracle.  I mean if you discount the plane's engineering, the navigation systems onboard, The experienced pilot, and the property damage caused by the falling debris from the plane.  What other explanation could there be?

Praise to FSM for guiding this plane safely.

We just have to face facts, Apollo saved them.