Looking at it from an Antiquity standpoint you have nothing to prove he ever lived. The NT can hardly be evidence for his existence since most of it was written 70 to 130 years after the fact. Antiquity goes not support a christian version of this jesus.
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| Poll: Do you think Jesus actually existed? This poll is closed. |
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| Yes | 8 | 14.81% | |
| No | 19 | 35.19% | |
| Not sure | 7 | 12.96% | |
| Don't Care | 12 | 22.22% | |
| I'm agnostic in regards to the existence of Jesus | 8 | 14.81% | |
| Total | 54 vote(s) | 100% | |
| * You voted for this item. | [Show Results] |
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Did Jesus Even Really Exist?
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I have never read about him in any historical text or document (Bible is not a historical text, rather a story book) so in my opinion, he was a character in one of many famous fairy tales from the ancient times.
 (November 25, 2011 at 9:12 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:(November 25, 2011 at 8:00 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Apologists will try to tell you that he was a nobody to those who would have written the accounts. They like to work in a little underdog narrative. Son of god, miracles left, right, and center. Entirely unremarkable. I agree Jesus was well known by the common people and some higher ranking where He traveled. This however was a very small area and covered only three years of work. John the Baptist preached in about the same area and probably worked no longer than Jesus. Do you know of any others as low ranking in status that has a larger record in history, should anyone even expect that individuals of their status (poor as they come) would ever have a historical record. I believe another reason that historical records on either are so few that, those perceived as trouble makers that upstage those who have great authority influence those who write that history. Is it not true that kings often threatened to kill those who would put them in bad light and so history is some what skewed from what is true.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
(November 27, 2011 at 4:21 am)Godschild Wrote: I agree Jesus was well known by the common people and some higher ranking where He traveled. This however was a very small area and covered only three years of work. John the Baptist preached in about the same area and probably worked no longer than Jesus. Do you know of any others as low ranking in status that has a larger record in history, should anyone even expect that individuals of their status (poor as they come) would ever have a historical record. I believe another reason that historical records on either are so few that, those perceived as trouble makers that upstage those who have great authority influence those who write that history. Is it not true that kings often threatened to kill those who would put them in bad light and so history is some what skewed from what is true. So how did the bible survive all this? RE: Did Jesus Even Really Exist?
November 27, 2011 at 4:30 am
(This post was last modified: November 27, 2011 at 4:35 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Casting the patina of doubt over what little we have with regards to antiquity does nothing to help your case. It only makes matters worse GC. Now I doubt the authenticity of any document yet to be discovered which would confirm christ's existence. After all, it could just be propaganda. Paid for a by a powerful christian sympathizer. Course, I bet that this line of reasoning only works for you when the conclusions reached are in your favor, right? You've got your answer, now you're just looking for ways to convince yourself and others that it's the right answer. Well, I remain unconvinced. Maybe if you let the evidence speak for itself without insisting that it has to conform to your preconceived notion of "biblical history" I'd take you seriously. Whats that? You don't have any, ah, I see.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
 (November 27, 2011 at 4:21 am)Godschild Wrote:(November 25, 2011 at 9:12 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote:(November 25, 2011 at 8:00 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Apologists will try to tell you that he was a nobody to those who would have written the accounts. They like to work in a little underdog narrative. Son of god, miracles left, right, and center. Entirely unremarkable. The NT is NOT an EYEWITNESS account of anything. None of the NT authors ever saw a physical jesus on the face of the earth. Not one! The Encloypedia Biblica states Quote:that the order of events in the life of Christ as given to us by the Evangelists are contradictory and untrustworthy and that the chronological framework of the Gospels is worthless. In other words Mark, Luke, Matthew and John wrote not what they knew but only what they imagined. New Testament itself contains the strongest evidence that Christ was not a real person. Walter R Cassels author of "Supernatural Religion" considered to be one of the greatest works on Christianity ever written had this to say: Quote: Quote:"After having exhausted the literature and the testimony bearing on the point, we have not found a single distinct trace of any of those Gospels during the First Century and a half after the death of Christ." The Gospel of Mark knows nothing of a virgin birth, a sermon on the Mount, the Lords prayer or any other of the facts of Jesus supposed life. These were facts added by Matthew and Luke. The Gospel of Mark as we have it is not the original Mark. In the first (3) Gospels and the fourth you meet (2) different Christs. It should be (3). (1). According to Mark Christ was a man. (2). According to Matthew and Luke he was a demigod. (3). While John insist he was God himself.  (November 27, 2011 at 4:21 am)Godschild Wrote: I agree Jesus was well known by the common people and some higher ranking where He traveled. Did I mention Herod Antipas? As the ruler the local client state of Rome, you can't dismiss him so easily. Quote:This however was a very small area and covered only three years of work. I quoted you the very passage of Mathew that states that Jesus' fame spread beyond the small areas he traveled. Quote:Do you know of any others as low ranking in status that has a larger record in history... None that brought back the dead, cast out demons, healed the sick...
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too." ... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept "(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question" ... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist RE: Did Jesus Even Really Exist?
November 27, 2011 at 1:16 pm
(This post was last modified: November 27, 2011 at 1:17 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 27, 2011 at 4:29 am)Forsaken Wrote: So how did the bible survive all this? It didn't. Que the King James and Apocrypha.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too." ... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept "(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question" ... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist 
If Jesus exists, then so must Hercules and Bachus and Mithras.
The same "system" used to suggest Jesus actually existed can be used to make MANY mythological heros and gods exist as well. |
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