(March 24, 2023 at 9:13 pm)arewethereyet Wrote:

(March 24, 2023 at 9:03 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote: It's not a matter of confusion it's a matter of logical coherency.  Are you suggesting that someone can come out as gay, the world celebrates her for being brave, courageous, and for finding her "true self" and then it turns out the person not only never was a lesbian but never was even a woman? How could we ever know who is really gay if they can simply say they were confused the whole-time years later?

Why are you so concerned about someone else's sexuality or how they identify?

How does it affect you?

Let me make it simple - why the fuck do you care?

Apparently, Page thinks everyone is concerned with their sexuality, hence why they have given two different statements to the BBC on it.  I am merely pointing out the logical absurdity within those statements, don't kill the messenger just because you hate the message.

(March 25, 2023 at 12:30 am)Rev. Rye Wrote: You know, maybe instead of focusing on the few cases where one part of the LGBTQ spectrum ends up identifying as a different part of the spectrum (like someone who previously considered themself a lesbian transforming themself into a trans man who seems to be functionally straight), there’s better possible groups that we could wonder about changing.

Maybe something like pedophilia, which, unlike the vast majority of LGBT people, is inherently dangerous if acted upon.

The OP was about whether someone who is gay can become straight.  Elliot Page proves that a lesbian can become a straight man.  There's a reason I brought it up, Page proves that orientation is mailable.  I realize people on here do not like that, but it's a fact.

(March 25, 2023 at 1:34 am)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(March 25, 2023 at 12:30 am)Rev. Rye Wrote: You know, maybe instead of focusing on the few cases where one part of the LGBTQ spectrum ends up identifying as a different part of the spectrum (like someone who previously considered themself a lesbian transforming themself into a trans man who seems to be functionally straight), there’s better possible groups that we could wonder about changing.

Maybe something like pedophilia, which, unlike the vast majority of LGBT people, is inherently dangerous if acted upon.

The OP was about whether someone who is gay can become straight.  Elliot Page proves that a lesbian can become a straight man.  There's a reason I brought it up, Page proves that orientation is mailable.  I realize people on here do not like that, but it's a fact.

Yeah, it's malleable if you're willing to change your gender identity with your orientation. That's the catch.

And the OP is about a study that would eventually be retracted because it was fundamentally flawed. And Boru quoted the statement from the scientist responsible which explained why it was fundamentally flawed on the first page.

He didn't suddenly become straight. As a man, the orientation is adjusted to match the gender identity. It's not complicated. The absurdity is in the misconception of suddenly going from gay to straight without accounting for the transgender aspect. And it's the absurd misconceptions that make people want to claim non-binary identity.

(March 25, 2023 at 1:34 am)Statler Waldorf Wrote: Elliot Page proves that a lesbian can become a straight man. 

Elliot Page proves that you can not change someone's gender but not their sexual preference.

(March 25, 2023 at 1:50 am)Rev. Rye Wrote:

(March 25, 2023 at 1:34 am)Statler Waldorf Wrote: The OP was about whether someone who is gay can become straight.  Elliot Page proves that a lesbian can become a straight man.  There's a reason I brought it up, Page proves that orientation is mailable.  I realize people on here do not like that, but it's a fact.

Yeah, it's malleable if you're willing to change your gender identity with your orientation. That's the catch.

And the OP is about a study that would eventually be retracted because it was fundamentally flawed. And Boru quoted the statement from the scientist responsible which explained why it was fundamentally flawed on the first page.

Good Heavens.  Transgenderism is not changing your gender, it's identifying your true gender.  How come it's the Christian who has to correct you on this stuff?

(March 25, 2023 at 2:12 am)Tomato Wrote: He didn't suddenly become straight. As a man, the orientation is adjusted to match the gender identity. It's not complicated. The absurdity is in the misconception of suddenly going from gay to straight without accounting for the transgender aspect. And it's the absurd misconceptions that make people want to claim non-binary identity.

...so was Elliot a lesbian in 2014?  No?

(March 25, 2023 at 2:23 am)Fake Messiah Wrote:

(March 25, 2023 at 1:34 am)Statler Waldorf Wrote: Elliot Page proves that a lesbian can become a straight man. 

Elliot Page proves that you can not change someone's gender but not their sexual preference.

If Elliot has always been a man, then why did Page come out as a lesbian in 2014?  Can men be lesbians?

(March 25, 2023 at 4:39 am)Statler Waldorf Wrote: If Elliot has always been a man, then why did Page come out as a lesbian in 2014?  Can men be lesbians?

Elliot always preferred women. That was not changed.

(March 25, 2023 at 4:39 am)Statler Waldorf Wrote: Can men be lesbians?

Ernest Hemingway seemed to consider himself a lesbian.

(March 24, 2023 at 9:17 pm)Belacqua Wrote:

(March 24, 2023 at 7:41 pm)emjay Wrote: As someone technically bi, I understand a lot of what you're saying. Though I identify primarily as gay (now, and for most of my life), rather than bi (or straight), there have been other times - though not many, granted - where I've identified more as straight and been more interested in women... so I have degrees of freedom here that my truly gay friends, who can't even conceive of being with a woman, don't. Ultimately I doubt there'll be a full 180 in my life like your examples, because overall I'm much more emotionally attracted to men than women, and that's more important to me than just physical attraction (which is the part that is the most 'interchangeable' for me), but it is nonetheless conceivable, in a different time, place, and mentality. 

Thank you for taking the time to understand what I was saying. I wasn't clear to everybody, apparently.
[...]

From all the convos we've ever had on here, one thing I'm pretty sure is that homophobic you are not... far from it; you seem very liberal minded to me, and hell, seem to have more gay friends than I do So whatever your leanings toward Christianity/theology, there's nothing you've ever said to me that suggests you have the sort of anti-gay agenda that usually goes hand in hand with it.

Things like 'conversion therapy' make my blood boil, not just the ludicrous notions that it could ever work to 'pray the gay away', or the downright insulting misuse of the word 'therapy' there, but most importantly that anyone should propose or feel pressured to try something like that in the first place. But again, there's nothing you've said that makes me think you're not just as opposed to this sort of 'therapy' or the pressures that underlie it.