FWIW, if this is all so amazing, surely it makes more sense that we are ideas in the mind of god ala various strains of Hinduism rather than the kludgy notion that we are clay shaped by a potter.

Nope, has to be mudman and ribwomen, or maybe we're the clotpeople. More gods that don't exist, because their x never was.

(July 15, 2023 at 2:30 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Nope, has to be mudman and ribwomen, or maybe we're the clotpeople.  More gods that don't exist, because their x never was.

From my standpoint we were made from noodles.

Pondering Islam I can't help but be reminded that a cave is a metaphor for a woman's vagina. Some find inspiration in vino, and others in a hairy bush.

(July 15, 2023 at 2:24 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: I doubt that you're all ears, or even willing to listen - but..ofc..all religions are a serious competitor for islam.  

And there, we have it. All religions are similar, and of equal initial plausibility. Go figure.
Consider the following example of religion A and religion B:

Religion A : "God created the world, and made 1=2"
Religion B : "God created the world"

Are religion A and B equally plausible, can we assign the same probability of being true to both of them ? Come on, I'm sure you can notice the difference.

(July 15, 2023 at 2:24 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote:

Quote:The God who fashioned stars, supernovas, galaxies, etc., who made universal physical laws for all the universe, doesn't fit the picture of a tribal god. 

It's also a god that doesn't exist.  Remember, the god that did x is predicate on x having been done.....but I'm not too concerned by that yet.  Every tribe swears their gods made the sun moon and stars.  Islam no less so.

I didn't know that every tribe have their own concept of God and their own exclusive belief system. You really are well-read in the anthropology of religion, aren't you ?

Islam explicitly states that it shares many core beliefs with Judaism and christianity, as originally revealed. It may have escaped your notice, but some religions aren't completely isolated from each other. Your tribal conception of religions is a bit outdated, I'm afraid.

(July 15, 2023 at 2:24 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote:

Quote:More to the point, God having a chosen people runs contrary to benevolence, justness, and countless other properties that are traditionally attributed to Him.

You already shit on properties traditionally attributed to god™...but..It doesn't - and you'll have to come up with even more batshit ad hoc rationalizations to explain that batshit ad hoc rationalization.  

Please address my remark and stop telling me what I should or shouldn't do.

God having a chosen people and excluding everybody else doesn't sit well with justness and benevolence. If you don't see why, I don't think you're equipped for any of this.

Except only my religion is right dice, yours is wrong.

Sorry to tell you.

(July 15, 2023 at 2:54 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: And there, we have it. All religions are similar, and of equal initial plausibility. Go figure.
Consider the following example of religion A and religion B:

Religion A : "God created the world, and made 1=2"
Religion B : "God created the world"

Are religion A and B equally plausible, can we assign the same probability of being true to both of them ? Come on, I'm sure you can notice the difference.

Neither of those are religious statements.  They are both superstitious claims - and are both equally probable - in that both are completely false.  Yes, though, I think that all religious claims are fundamentally equivalent.  That equivalence is what identifies them as religious claims in the first place?  

Quote:I didn't know that every tribe have their own concept of God and their own exclusive belief system. You really are well-read in the anthropology of religion, aren't you ?

Islam explicitly states that it shares many core beliefs with Judaism and christianity, as originally revealed. It may have escaped your notice, but some religions aren't completely isolated from each other. Your tribal conception of religions is a bit outdated, I'm afraid.

I am.  This might throw you for a loop, but atheists are commonly more knowledgeable about religion than the religious...and I'm kindof a nerd even in that rarified group.  I love this stuff...and more, likely, than anyone as committed as you probably fancy yourself to be...to any one of the things in this stuff.  Unfortunately, there's no money in the us in anthropology or religious studies...unless you're willing to con the faithful like a common imam - and that..I don't have in me.

That "as originally revealed" is doing alot of work for you there, isn't it. It's a way of calling them liars while stealing their beliefs, lol.

Quote:Please address my remark and stop telling me what I should or shouldn't do.

God having a chosen people and excluding everybody else doesn't sit well with justness and benevolence. If you don't see why, I don't think you're equipped for any of this.

Aw, poor little you, victimized by me observing that you swirl further into the drain of inanity with every post, never realizing that you should stop, take a breath, and consider that you're causing harm to your own god concepts and intuitions.

I'd say stick with your instincts, here. You probably cant explain why, in a 100% sound and valid argument, you think that's obvious. I'll even do you the solid of suggesting that you don't want it to be true, as I will immediately use that to argue against your own religion, in your own words.

@Loaded dice

Do you believe you have targeted your audience properly? Do you really believe you'll convince anyone here of your goofy religion or it's (alleged) founder the profit Muhammad (piss be upon him)? If you truly believe either of those things, you're even dumber than the proverbial bag of hammers.

(July 15, 2023 at 3:32 pm)Ravenshire Wrote: @Loaded dice

Do you believe you have targeted your audience properly? Do you really believe you'll convince anyone here of your goofy religion or it's (alleged) founder the profit Muhammad (piss be upon him)? If you truly believe either of those things, you're even dumber than the proverbial bag of hammers.

Wait a minute now, I'll have you know my claw hammer just got it's degree.

(July 15, 2023 at 3:32 pm)Ravenshire Wrote: @Loaded dice

Do you believe you have targeted your audience properly? Do you really believe you'll convince anyone here of your goofy religion or it's (alleged) founder the profit Muhammad (piss be upon him)? If you truly believe either of those things, you're even dumber than the proverbial bag of hammers.

Some of these theists come here thinking they are going to win over some souls/converts.  Maybe to earn points with their god.  

They are unable to read the room.  And they prove it time and time again.