(July 21, 2023 at 2:29 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: You're not interested in eternal bliss ? 

You're lying.

How. Fucking. Dare you!

Loaded dice, you have just done something that I find utterly unforgivable. Accusing me of lying about my own worldview and desires is the guaranteed way to make me your enemy for life.

It is my personal wish that life treat you with such egregious cruelty that your love for Islam turns to utter despair, then disgust, then emptiness that endures to your last breath.

Make it so. (slams gavel down on Loaded dice's fingers)

(July 21, 2023 at 2:29 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: You're not interested in eternal bliss ? 

You're lying.

As Astreja already pointed out: A modified version of me enjoying this "eternal bliss" is not me.

Knowing that some of my atheist family and friends will not be with me in this "eternal bliss" is not eternal bliss but pure horror for ME, aside from the fact that i will be knowing THEY will be in a worse place.
Being a self-absorbed piece of shit, like you are, thats how someone enjoys "eternal bliss" while others, whom you mabye love, wont. I rather spend eternal damnation with Astreja than "eternal bliss" with someone so thoroughly fucked up by religion like you.

And no, i am not lying. I really think you are a self-absorbed piece for shit, who wastes no thoughts whatsoever on others, as demonstrated, by you.

I still don't see where Islam owns atheism. 

You are not wearing blinders, you have more than 1 functioning brain cell, mommy didn't deprive you of oxygen, so it is understandable Gwaithmir.

We're not lying for not being interested in eternal bliss. Yes, it would be worth being interested in if it was real but it's NOT real.

If being lobotomized for "eternal bliss" is worth it, it's not like anyone has to wait to get into heaven to opt-in on that one. I don't see any lines forming up, so any comments about who may be lying about what probably aren't going to skew in an islamists favor.

(July 22, 2023 at 3:34 am)Gwaithmir Wrote: I still don't see where Islam owns atheism. 

The same way a hallucinating pauper owns the Bank of England.

Since the "OMG, eternal bliss in heaven is what all the cool kids really want, even if they're lying about it, because eternal bliss in heaven, with gawd, would be so totally awesome!!!11!!1!one!!!" argument has raised it's simple-minded head again, I offer this: Who the fuck wants to live forever?

When eternal life is the curse, the initial conditions don't fucking matter.

The conditions matter very much to our buddy here. It's not like he wants to get lobotomized into blissfully sodomizing men for his girls pleasure.

That kind of bliss only flows one way. It's only worth it if other people are the ones being lobotomized. Heaven is basically a whorehouse for whatever perverted shit bounces around the head that might shame a person, in life.

-and who wouldn't want that, thinks the deviant.

(July 21, 2023 at 5:05 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote: Not because you say so.
There's nothing miraculous about the emergence of the Qur'an. Just like all the other writing of the day, it "borrowed" many well-known stories from surrounding cultures.

1. Moses and the Fish, (came from Babylon/Ugarit/the El myths),
2. Solomon listening to the ants, common fairy tales, existing all over the Ancient Near East,
3. Jinns, (genies) working for Solomon, both common fairy tales, existing all over the Ancient Near East,
<snip>

I think I told you before that copying and pasting garbage claims from christian polemics isn't going to help you.

Stick to ONE Topic, got it ? one. And when you do, please defend your claim with your own words and stop flooding the thread with copied nonsense.

As for your garbage claim that the Qur'an "borrowed" stuff : in case you didn't know, and apparently you don't, there were many instances of divine revelation before Muhammad, according to Islam itself, and in fact, all prophets are Muslims (e.g. share the same core message of monotheism that Muhammad PBUH proclaimed) . So any similarity between the Qur'an and age-old stories can always be explained by the latter being remnants of pre-Islam divine revelation.

(July 22, 2023 at 3:03 am)Deesse23 Wrote: Knowing that some of my atheist family and friends will not be with me in this "eternal bliss" is not eternal bliss but pure horror for ME

If your friends or family screw up and don't get eternal bliss, they only have themselves to blame, it's divine justice, and so it applies to everybody : including your (and my) loved ones. It's extremely hard to accept that, but that's what divine justice means.

If you don't want to accept that, then you'll be a hypocrite, you want your loved ones to get the ultimate divine reward without deserving it. That's human and understandable, everybody wants their loved ones to not go to jail, for example. But if they do break the law and get caught, you can't really say it's unfair to you because you'll be too sad to see them face justice. Yes, you'll feel really bad for them, but then what, can you really blame the justice system? -can you really blame divine justice because it's too much for your feelings ?

FYI, this issue was actually raised by the Qur'an in vivid detail, in numerous verses, bear with me : 

37:51; One of them will say, “I once had a companion ˹in the world˺
37:52 : who used to ask ˹me˺, ‘Do you actually believe ˹in resurrection˺?
37:53 : When we are dead and reduced to dust and bones, will we really be brought to judgment?’”
37:54 : He will ˹then˺ ask, “Would you care to see ˹his fate˺?”
37:55 : Then he ˹and the others˺ will look and spot him in the midst of the Hellfire.
37:56 : He will ˹then˺ say, “By Allah! You nearly ruined me.
37:57 :  Had it not been for the grace of my Lord, I ˹too˺ would have certainly been among those brought ˹to Hell˺.”
37:58 : ˹Then he will ask his fellow believers,˺ “Can you imagine that we will never die,
37:59 : except our first death, nor be punished ˹like the others˺?”

In another surah', the Qur'an explains how family members literally stop caring about each other in the Day of Judgement:

80:33 : Then, when the Deafening Blast (=Day of Judgment) comes to pass—
80:34:  on that Day every person will flee from their own siblings,
80:35: and ˹even˺ their mother and father,
80:36: and ˹even˺ their spouse and children.
80:37: For then everyone will have enough concern of their own.

As you can see, the Qur'an devoted many verses to this issue, and explained clearly that people will be in a state of extreme fear and panic, they'll only care about their own salvation, even at the expense of that of their own family members. It's literally what the Qur'an says, yet in another surah':

70:11 : ˹although˺ they will be made to see each other. The wicked will wish to ransom themselves from the punishment of that Day by their children,
70:12 : their spouses, their siblings,
70:13 : their clan that sheltered them,
70:14 : and everyone on earth altogether, just to save themselves.

And that's not all: even the prophets will only care about their own salvation, except Muhammad PBUH. According to hadiths, he's the only prophet who'll worry about the fate of his followers.

So, to sum it up for you, I think you'll be too worried about your own fate to even think about your friends and family.