(August 21, 2023 at 6:00 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Shame and pride might take a little finesse.  Fear just comes to us.

Hmm, I find shame comes naturally and fear requires a trigger of some kind.

True. Fear seems much more baked in. Shame, less so. I can't remember the last time I felt proud of something?

(August 21, 2023 at 1:08 am)FrustratedFool Wrote: Given the alternative is death, I'd say it was worth it.  I prefer to live as I am than die, obviously.  Though the gap is very small.

But you've only experience life to this point. How do we know death isn't better?

I feel shame and pride in equal measure.

Know? What we know is very, very limited.

However, it seems highly likely that death is the permanent cessation of consciousness, which would entail the loss of all goods and all potential for goods (like pleasure). The only way death become preferable to me, then, is if I have lost all realistic hope of future goods and the current suffering outweighs the current goods.

As for pride and shame, I have little of either. Are they equal to me? I can't tell.

(August 21, 2023 at 6:16 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(August 21, 2023 at 1:08 am)FrustratedFool Wrote: Given the alternative is death, I'd say it was worth it.  I prefer to live as I am than die, obviously.  Though the gap is very small.

But you've only experience life to this point. How do we know death isn't better?

Rational, hey?

(August 21, 2023 at 6:19 am)FrustratedFool Wrote: Know?  What we know is very, very limited.

However, it seems highly likely that death is the permanent cessation of consciousness, which would entail the loss of all goods and all potential for goods (like pleasure).  The only way death become preferable to me, then, is if I have lost all realistic hope of future goods and the current suffering outweighs the current goods.

As for pride and shame, I have little of either.  Are they equal to me?  I can't tell.

My suffering is greater than my pleasure and I would still rather be alive. Literally anything is better than not being conscious at all.

I can't see how agony with no respite or hope of change, like hell for example, would be preferable to annihilation. But it's subjective, so do what works.

(August 21, 2023 at 6:20 am)MarcusA Wrote:

(August 21, 2023 at 6:16 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: But you've only experience life to this point. How do we know death isn't better?

Rational, hey?

Why? What is your basis for saying one is better than the other? You have no evidence for the one, just the one you've experienced. Not rationality, but fear fuels the typical response.

(August 21, 2023 at 6:27 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(August 21, 2023 at 6:20 am)MarcusA Wrote: Rational, hey?

Why? What is your basis for saying one is better than the other? You have no evidence for the one, just the one you've experienced. Not rationality, but fear fuels the typical response.

I have no fear of death. The End is the end full stop