(January 26, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Godschild Wrote: As I explained there's no contradiction, in no way is Jame's saying one must work to receive their salvation.

I'm not saying that James said that, I'm saying Jesus said that. Many times.

(January 26, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(January 26, 2012 at 5:46 am)Epimethean Wrote: Is the non-believer able to eat the imaginary pizza he did not buy? These questions are indeed troubling.

It's your question that is not only troubling but, quite confusing.

And yet it parallels questions with which you find no problems at all. Interesting.

I scrolled through this post fairly quickly, so I may have missed a few posts. But, there seems to be some confusion as to the question. I read: if God really loves us we should be able to witness his works for us. I would argue that God does a couple of things for us. He spoke the world into existence, continues to hold the fabric of existence together, limits mans penchant for self destruction (individually and sociologically), destroyed the union of the triune God to close the breach between our fallen lives and the paradise we were designed for, gives the spirit that equips us for doing his will, sanctifies us, changes our desires, blesses the world with beauty, talent, and love, etc...

As for the "unbeliever," God does quite a bit for them too, whether they acknowledge it or not. (I fail to acknowledge the majority of good works done on my account as well). It's the classic Mozart vs. Salieri issue (if you have seen the movie). God works on behalf of all of his creation, believer or not. At least that is what the Bible teaches: the rain falls on the just and unjust alike (rain connotes blessing not curse). If you don't believe the Bible (or just haven't read it), you might think it just rains because (fill in scientific explanation of rain). If you do, God uses the scientific laws he designed to give the world another crop.

To sum it up, believers often think of God as a magic genie that is supposed to help you win the lotto; if I don't get what I want, God must be dead or not working hard enough for me. The God revealed the Bible doesn't work that way. His nature actually makes a lot more sense, and he actually takes care of us in ways that matter.

Any thoughts?

Sorry jared..."No Sale"

(January 26, 2012 at 4:57 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote:

(January 26, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Godschild Wrote: As I explained there's no contradiction, in no way is Jame's saying one must work to receive their salvation.

I'm not saying that James said that, I'm saying Jesus said that. Many times.

Give me the passages where Jesus said that one must do works to be saved.

Jared, just keep the faith.

(January 27, 2012 at 1:22 am)Godschild Wrote:

(January 26, 2012 at 4:57 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote:

(January 26, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Godschild Wrote: As I explained there's no contradiction, in no way is Jame's saying one must work to receive their salvation.

I'm not saying that James said that, I'm saying Jesus said that. Many times.

Give me the passages where Jesus said that one must do works to be saved.

Are you saying G-C that you don't know your own "hooey book"

(January 27, 2012 at 8:37 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote:

(January 27, 2012 at 1:22 am)Godschild Wrote:

(January 26, 2012 at 4:57 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote:

(January 26, 2012 at 2:49 pm)Godschild Wrote: As I explained there's no contradiction, in no way is Jame's saying one must work to receive their salvation.

I'm not saying that James said that, I'm saying Jesus said that. Many times.

Give me the passages where Jesus said that one must do works to be saved.

Are you saying G-C that you don't know your own "hooey book"

I know Jesus never said that works save, I want to see the verses that causes D-T to believe Jesus said works save, isn't that fair.

Check out Matthew 25:33-45 for starters. The parable about the sheep & the goats.

(January 27, 2012 at 2:57 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: Check out Matthew 25:33-45 for starters. The parable about the sheep & the goats.

Christ says to those who did unto others as you would have done unto me,
Christ says to those who did not do unto others as you would do unto me, the real difference here is that the goats do not believe in Christ, so they could not have treated others as they would Christ. They are judged for their unbelief and their actions show their unbelief.