Trying to shepherd cats.

"Atheists" are such a broad ranging group with differing philosophies it's very difficult to get them into any organised status. As soon as there is one group going, with its manifesto and logo, another one starts.

About the only thing we agree on is that there is little probability for the existance of a god or gods. And then only just, coz strong atheists will say there is definitely and demonstrably no god, while others put it in terms of likelyhood.

I like it best when informal support groups spontaneously pop up, do their job and evolve.

Although it can be argued that a formal atheist lobby group is required to protect the interests of secularism, there is always the danger that it will label atheism as a religion after all, and I suspect, in-fighting and human politics and rivalry will always cause SNAFU

The problems that theism and teocracies pose on society differ from country to country.

(August 27, 2008 at 6:04 am)StewartP Wrote: Trying to shepherd cats.

"Atheists" are such a broad ranging group with differing philosophies it's very difficult to get them into any organised status. As soon as there is one group going, with its manifesto and logo, another one starts.

About the only thing we agree on is that there is little probability for the existance of a god or gods. And then only just, coz strong atheists will say there is definitely and demonstrably no god, while others put it in terms of likelyhood.

Perhaps the small similarity we have will make it easier to relate considering a lot of rules would change from different viewpoints.

I think it is always going to be a problem. The atheists who call themselves "Objectivists" can hardly be considered naturalists or rationalists since they believe in something which has no evidence (consciousness existing separate to reality).

(August 27, 2008 at 6:38 am)Tiberius Wrote: I think it is always going to be a problem. The atheists who call themselves "Objectivists" can hardly be considered naturalists or rationalists since they believe in something which has no evidence (consciousness existing separate to reality).

I suppose there's no fine line between Atheist, Agnostic and Theist. It's more of a huge blurr

Atheism is not a belief system.

Atheism is not a reaction to religion.

We are all born atheists. That includes Muslims, Buddists, Hindus, etc.

It's the sad fact that those people who are already infected by religious belief will in turn indoctrinate their children. Most of these children, depending on where they live will have no choice but to tow the line or suffer the consequences of ostracisation from family and/or community or worse some form of violent punishment.

Atheism is a personal realisation by rational, intelligent people that there is no supreme creator. An atheist lives without the mind controlling, invasive and relationship damaging man-made dogma that occurs in the many books of religion.

In Australia there are small groups of atheists in every city that hold gatherings, but I don't think it needs occur in such a very secular nation.

I can understand the need in countries such as the USA, and if it were at all possible in Muslim countries!

Religious people are an oddity and very much a minority here. Most images of church congregations could also be images from nursing homes.

(August 27, 2008 at 6:47 am)KRW1612 Wrote: Atheism is not a belief system.

Atheism is not a reaction to religion.

We are all born atheists. That includes Muslims, Buddists, Hindus, etc.

I dont think so, if Religion didn't exist would we still all be Atheists? Or if there were no Atheists would there be Theists?

If there were no cars would there be no offical non-drivers?

If religion didn't exist I am sure some people would still believe in gods. If there were no atheists then yes there would be only theists. Whether they would still refer to themselves by that name might be a more worthy topic.

(August 27, 2008 at 7:33 am)Tiberius Wrote: If religion didn't exist I am sure some people would still believe in gods. If there were no atheists then yes there would be only theists. Whether they would still refer to themselves by that name might be a more worthy topic.

Exactly! But then again I doubt we'd start labeling people because you've done or believe in something.

You're a Athe-fireman. And fireman are now theifireman.

(August 27, 2008 at 6:55 am)Brick-top Wrote:

(August 27, 2008 at 6:47 am)KRW1612 Wrote: Atheism is not a belief system.

Atheism is not a reaction to religion.

We are all born atheists. That includes Muslims, Buddists, Hindus, etc.

I dont think so, if Religion didn't exist would we still all be Atheists? Or if there were no Atheists would there be Theists?

?????????????? If religion didn't exist!!!!! What does that mean? Religion today equals more than 10,000 variations of thought.

Every person on this planet is born an Atheist. A one year old child has no knowledge of any god or gods. However in religious families once speach and written communication skills are developed the religious parents/teachers/clergy prey on that child and enforce their beliefs.

There is no denying this.

The Australian Aboriginal is a very primitive people and when discovered by explorers some 230 years ago, was seen to be somewhat savage.

They did not house themselves, they did not have a written language and their tools were no better than stone-age europeans.

(August 27, 2008 at 6:55 am)Brick-top Wrote:

(August 27, 2008 at 6:47 am)KRW1612 Wrote: Atheism is not a belief system.

Atheism is not a reaction to religion.

We are all born atheists. That includes Muslims, Buddists, Hindus, etc.

I dont think so, if Religion didn't exist would we still all be Atheists?

We are all born without any knowledge and certainly without any beliefs.

We are then systematically fed information about life, the do's and don'ts, the good and bad, etc. Belief in a supreme deity and/or an attached religion is taught.

When white man arrived in Australia 230 years ago they had never heard of the Christian god or Jesus Christ or Allah or Mohammed. Why? because they had never been taught about these entities. Entities that have been man made by other peoples.

Therefore we are all born non-believers until such time as some of us are indoctrinated by the teachers of religion, whether they be familly, school teachers, clergy, etc.

If you started a community on a remote island without any knowledge of the current crop of gods and religions, and they had no contact with the rest of the world for 6 generations they would never know the Christian god, or any of the others. However they may have created their own by then, or remained without any.