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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 1:54 pm
(May 7, 2013 at 3:32 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: (May 7, 2013 at 2:12 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: There are plenty of atheists who are neither nihilists nor rationalists. Tell me more. It seems to me that you either believe in a reality that acts according reason or you do not.
I suppose, but atheism isn't the word for believing in a reality that acts according to reason. You can't divide different categories along the same lines.
There's nothing inconsistent with being an atheist and believing in (say) ESP, although a rationalist would be hard-put to justify having such a belief. There's also nothing inconsistent with being an atheist while being a Buddhist, Jain, Taoist, Raellian, Jedi, etc.
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 1:54 pm
(May 13, 2013 at 1:49 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: I can object. But then I get called a cry baby. I believe there's a line you shouldn't cross, and that a person deserves respect. But you can't force that on others.
Who's forcing? Just as one has the right to be disrespectful, I have the right to voice my opinion about that disrespect.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 2:36 pm
(May 13, 2013 at 1:47 pm)Rhythm Wrote: You've never toiled under a lack of opportunity to contest some conclusion I might reach about a statement you make. In fact I've practically begged you to contest this stuff, from our very first interaction...it's always been your choice to let it ride Frods.
(I maintain, of course, that it's not really much of a choice, you've simply made statements which you were incapable of backing up or elaborating upon..but hey..I could be wrong, care to contest?)
That would suggest we haven't thrashed it out some already in chat Rhydd. I provided you with reams of justifications and you only, to me, wind the situation up. That's the only reason I have you on ignore... that you refuse to address any problem put to you, much like you did above.
I know where any conversation will go with you, and that's somewhere inside your naval. I've decided that I don't want to entertain that lost cause any longer.
Of course I have the opportunity, when off my mobile (which isn't often), to reveal posts hidden to me. I do that if I think the context might elicit a sensible opinion from you. Mostly, I know your answer is to be illogically dismissive, and you refuse to discuss it.
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 3:31 pm
(This post was last modified: May 13, 2013 at 3:40 pm by Mister Agenda.)
(May 9, 2013 at 4:47 am)fr0d0 Wrote: That's the wrong question Esq. See above for how that defeats itself. The only verifiable evidence of God is everything in existence.
So, affirming the consequent?
If P, then Q.
Q.
Therefore, P.
If God exists, the universe exists.
The universe exists.
Therefore, God.
If fr0d0 is the god of seashells, seashells exist.
Seashells exist.
Therefore, fr0d0 is the god of seashells.
(May 9, 2013 at 10:24 am)ChadWooters Wrote: (May 9, 2013 at 3:19 am)Esquilax Wrote: What, of the evidence we have, points to the existence of a god? The regularity of natural laws. If there is not a reason for things happening according to order then there is no reason why they should happen at all. (details above)
That's easily turned around by pointing out that an omnipotent God with volition could change the rules at any moment. Some prophecies predict he will.
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 3:51 pm
(This post was last modified: May 13, 2013 at 3:52 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(May 13, 2013 at 2:36 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: That would suggest we haven't thrashed it out some already in chat Rhydd. I provided you with reams of justifications and you only, to me, wind the situation up. That's the only reason I have you on ignore... that you refuse to address any problem put to you, much like you did above.
I know where any conversation will go with you, and that's somewhere inside your naval. I've decided that I don't want to entertain that lost cause any longer.
Of course I have the opportunity, when off my mobile (which isn't often), to reveal posts hidden to me. I do that if I think the context might elicit a sensible opinion from you. Mostly, I know your answer is to be illogically dismissive, and you refuse to discuss it.
Any particular problem? Or is this a return to the good ole Frodospeak we love - claim a vaporous "something" in support of the existence of yet another vaporous "something" -?
Reams would suggest that you were able to provide me with anything, which you were not. But you're free to try again, just so everyone can see those "reams". Eh?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 3:51 pm
(May 12, 2013 at 1:58 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Easy question Rhydd. Human potential is maximised given a just and loving God. Show me how that works any other way, and I'll show you another way of describing god.
Well, since the God people believe in is imaginary (unlikely to have much connection to a real God if one exists), there are as many ways to describe God as are consistent with your conception of her.
Human potential is rarely maximized, so an omnipotent God who wants it maximized is unlikely. The vast majority of humanity is capable of more.
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 4:37 pm
If human potential is maximized given a just and loving God, why does humanity make strides so much more frequently than we did when we were in thrall to this just and loving god?
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 5:24 pm
(May 13, 2013 at 4:37 pm)Ryantology Wrote: If human potential is maximized given a just and loving God, why does humanity make strides so much more frequently than we did when we were in thrall to this just and loving god?
1. Because people don't choose it.
2. Technological advancement is a different subject
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 5:35 pm
(May 13, 2013 at 5:24 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: 1. Because people don't choose it. They didn't choose to maximize their potential until they crawled out from underneath a religion which cares nothing about humanity or its potential? A religion which emphasized feudalism and slavery and restricting behavior?
Quote:2. Technological advancement is a different subject
I very much disagree.
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RE: Atheism Undermines Knowledge
May 13, 2013 at 5:38 pm
(May 13, 2013 at 5:24 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: (May 13, 2013 at 4:37 pm)Ryantology Wrote: If human potential is maximized given a just and loving God, why does humanity make strides so much more frequently than we did when we were in thrall to this just and loving god?
1. Because people don't choose it.
2. Technological advancement is a different subject
about that 2....
- Emancipation of Women
- Abolition of slavery
I don't see technology there....
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