(November 2, 2013 at 5:03 pm)GodsRevolt Wrote: So, if we are addressing the problem of evil (which assumes the existence of a God, otherwise how could He be so careless?) I can talk about God and Pain, but I cannot bring up heaven, which would be the philosophies presentation of the end of all pain, or what God said in regards to suffering and pain.

Next thread to start: Discussion of Moby Dick, but if anyone brings up Ishmael I declare them completely off topic!

Assumes existence of a god? I think evil pretty much makes the existence of a good god impossible, but your god bitchslaps people, so yes we can make allowances for the sake of argument.

But no you cannot bring up heaven because heaven is christianity's way of opting out of all responsibilities here on earth. God's and their own. Almost every religion has something like that, buddhism believes in karma that happens in this lifetime, and also those that happen in the next life, so they don't have to account for all the times they fail to karma people. So yes, it is a complete cop out by invoking something that you cannot proof and no one can ever proof and saying that because it exists it justifies suffering.

Oh, excuse me, you can bring it up if you want to, I'm just letting you know I'm not going to take that kind of argument seriously.

So are you a christian?

(October 30, 2013 at 7:07 pm)leodeo Wrote: i talked to a pastor and he said that "god doesnt directly intervene in our lives because we have free will....but he loves us more than we can ever imagine and only wants the best for us"......wtf?

This makes it sound like you chose to have a mental illness. Usually in response to illnesses you get an explanation about how God has a plan to use you to bring more people to him (which isn't a better answer at all when you think about it) then cap it off with how he's beyond our human comprehension, which is a fancy way of saying...

(November 1, 2013 at 11:40 pm)leodeo Wrote: Pastor: "Look, God works in mysterious ways

That.

(November 2, 2013 at 10:26 pm)pineapplebunnybounce Wrote: Assumes existence of a god? I think evil pretty much makes the existence of a good god impossible, but your god bitchslaps people, so yes we can make allowances for the sake of argument.

But no you cannot bring up heaven because heaven is christianity's way of opting out of all responsibilities here on earth. God's and their own. Almost every religion has something like that, buddhism believes in karma that happens in this lifetime, and also those that happen in the next life, so they don't have to account for all the times they fail to karma people. So yes, it is a complete cop out by invoking something that you cannot proof and no one can ever proof and saying that because it exists it justifies suffering.

Oh, excuse me, you can bring it up if you want to, I'm just letting you know I'm not going to take that kind of argument seriously.

If the question addresses the Christian stance on a certain subject (and the problem of evil is a very important one when it comes to Christianity and needs to be addressed) the using parts of Christianity to address that question only makes sense.

If someone asks what Christians have to say about subject A then you have to allow the Christian to talk about subject A from a Christian point of view, which would involve Christian ideas.

Now, if you cannot entertain a thought that is outside of your world-view it would be a lot easier for you not to enter the conversation in the first place.

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(November 2, 2013 at 5:17 pm)Ryantology Wrote: There is only suffering because God made suffering possible, and he would only do that if he enjoys suffering, because there is no such thing as necessity for an omnipotent and omniscient being.

This makes a lot of assumptions about something that is, by definition, outside of our understanding. I mean, do you know what it is like to be omniscient or omnipotent?

Motive is difficult to understand even in our own lives. How can you expect an omnipotent being's motives be summed up in one post on an internet forum?

Not entertain the thought of heaven? Didn't I already say even if heaven exists it doesn't justify suffering? That's as far as entertaining goes, if you want to use heaven to make you feel better about all the suffering, that's your business, but if you want to bring your emotional blanket into a discussion no one's going to take you seriously. The topic, if I'm not mistaken, is pain and suffering, not evil. And yes, heaven still makes god evil, incase you're wondering.