Drich Wrote:That said I know i am a little harder on some of you. Brakeman, and xpastor come to mind Why? because I have caught brakeman lying several times and I am pretty sure xpastor is. (Because how could an real/paid pastor be so clueless about the basics of christianity?) Either the good 'pastor' is intentionally misrepersenting Christianity, Is a complete fraud, or was just outright a bad pastor. I see the effort he puts into some of his posts and i believe if he put in 1/2 the effort into his duties as a pastor as he does here he wouldn't have been as incomentant as he is showing himself to be. Which brings us back to he is either intentionally misrepersenting Christianity or he is lying about being a pastor.

What basic truth of Christianity am I ignorant of? Name one thing I said that showed ignorance of fundamental Christian doctrines. I know very well what they are, I just don't believe in them anymore.

I once believed in Christian doctrine including the inerrancy of the Bible. I came to see that it was not true. I speak and write what I now believe to be true. How is that a lie? Again I repeat you know bugger-all about me. I put in work weeks of 80 - hours when I was the pastor of a little church. I wasn`t making a fortune like these assholes in the megachurches and the televangelists whom you probably admire. I.Changed.My.Mind. For good logical reasons. I'm not the only one. I am a member of a group which includes over 500 former pastors who have rejected belief in the supernatural. They all have more education about religion than you do. Try reading about 5 books by Bart Ehrman so you will have a faint clue about what the majority of of New Testament scholars are thinking.

You're just sour because you can`t answer the criticisms which I make of Christian belief. In fact, 90% of the time it seems to go right over your head and you don`t even know what I was talking about although everyone else does.

You are in fact an asshole. I don't know why you think being an asshole helps your cause. Aractus, for instance, is a conservative Christian. I disagree with almost everything he believes about the bible, but I respect him because he is honest and intelligent, even if I think he is mistaken about many things.

Quote:In fact, 90% of the time it seems to go right over your head

That would be a significant improvement for Drippy.

I'm I think I missed the part in the op where a
Xpastor actually said that the virgin is proof of divinity, because what I read demonstrated a possible origin of the story and didnt really address the deity bit. Maybe drich read a different post.

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Oh and drippy partheogensis in humans would only create female off spring

Whats surprising is that the Gospel writers would include such an awkward/embarrassing detail - Mary becoming pregnant while betrothed to Joseph.

(December 18, 2013 at 10:40 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: Whats surprising is that the Gospel writers would include such an awkward/embarrassing detail - Mary becoming pregnant while betrothed to Joseph.

Because they figured people would be gullible enough to fall for the a ghost impregnated me line, which would make her pregnancy out of wedlock magically okay in their eyes.

Why announce to everyone that Joseph married a woman who was already pregnant?

In today's society nobody would even care but in THAT society such an embarrassing admission would heap shame and ridicule on those involved.

Skeptics would say ...oh that detail was added/fabricated to help build the Messianic prophecy case, but;

a) You couldn't do that in isolation. There were many other prophecies which needed to be fulfilled apart from just a virgin birth.

b) If you knew it was a fabrication, so too did other people. And why invite persecution or martyrdom for something you and everyone else thinks is a lie to cover up an unmarried mother scandal.

c) If every claimant to the title of Messiah is dismissed as a pretender who merely contrives to make it appear that they are fulfilling ancient prophecy, how then does the REAL Messiah differentiate themself from every other person
born in Bethlehem, who had prophetic ancestry, rode a donkey, was born of a virgin, got Crucified...

(December 18, 2013 at 11:50 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: but;

It is all fabricated. None of it happened.

The thing about fiction is that nothing has to follow realistically from one plot to the next, so long as there are people who will believe it merely for the sake of foregoing reason to accept it.

Quote:born in Bethlehem

Did you ever bother reading that particular bit of bullshit, Lyin?

(December 18, 2013 at 11:50 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: Why announce to everyone that Joseph married a woman who was already pregnant?

These are what we call "plot holes," Lion. Or possibly out of character moments. They occur in fictional works, when the writer hasn't been paying much attention to factual accuracy or characterization.

But I think it's really weird that you're presenting a bunch of atheists with a problem that only is a problem if we accept a story as true that, by definition, we kinda believe is false.

WTF?

After two children and multiple partners "I'm STILL a Virgin"?

Yeah, Virgin on the ridiculous