(September 18, 2014 at 11:01 am)Mister Agenda Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 2:34 pm)Chas Wrote: Note that the groups are identified by religion. Just a coincidence?

Note that there's one dominant religion in the region, so it won't be a coincidence if almost every group is dominated by members of that religon. Note that the Baathists were a secular nationalist movement. Note that the Iranian president we ousted was a socialist reformer. Note that the Soviet-backed Afghani government we helped bring down was secular communist. We couldn't have arranged for fundamentalist Islamism to sweep the region better if that was our aim all along. Actually, given our record, if that had been what we were aiming for, the area would probably be much more secular now.

If so, then why identify them by religion? It's because that is the most important aspect of the whole stinking pile of dog shit. They are theocracies - religion is inextricably bound up in politics.

Another good article IMHO:

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2...11116.html

Quote:Arab civilization, such as we knew it, is all but gone. The Arab world today is more violent, unstable, fragmented and driven by extremism—the extremism of the rulers and those in opposition—than at any time since the collapse of the Ottoman Empire a century ago. Every hope of modern Arab history has been betrayed. The promise of political empowerment, the return of politics, the restoration of human dignity heralded by the season of Arab uprisings in their early heydays—all has given way to civil wars, ethnic, sectarian and regional divisions and the reassertion of absolutism, both in its military and atavistic forms. With the dubious exception of the antiquated monarchies and emirates of the Gulf—which for the moment are holding out against the tide of chaos—and possibly Tunisia, there is no recognizable legitimacy left in the Arab world.

(September 18, 2014 at 3:05 pm)Chas Wrote: If so, then why identify them by religion?

Force of habit? Three of those groups really had nothing to do with Islam, and we deposed all three of them.

(September 18, 2014 at 3:05 pm)Chas Wrote: It's because that is the most important aspect of the whole stinking pile of dog shit. They are theocracies - religion is inextricably bound up in politics.

I can, with equal justification, claim that had Islam not been invented and the dominant religion of the area was Orthodox Christianity, you'd be claiming Orthodox Christianity is the most important aspect of the whole stinking pile of dog shit...or maybe you wouldn't.

I'd place orthodox christianity third, after islam - and of course both under the much more salient aspect of politics. Just couldn't help but offer that up.

Islam does have statements calling out for erradicating polytheistic religions, but none of them necessarily by force. One thing that is highly misinterpreted in western countries, is that muslims do not consider christians or jews as infidels.

In fact out of curiosity, i'm portuguese and the islam did occupied the iberian peninsula from ~700-1200 a.c. but one thing that is usually not told, is that islamic troops only "invaded" iberia, because they were literally invited by some regions' nobles to join them and protect them in their quest for occupying other reigns in Iberia, and only because they knew that Sharia Laws' demanded that Muslims had to defend the other believers of the scriptures like Jews and Christians! After the campaigns, the ammount of Islamic forces in Iberia Peninsula was so overwhelming that they easily expelled the noble's from the lands and declared the caliphate in the peninsula.

So it's clear that ISIS while saying they're trying to impose Sharia Laws' , is actually acting against it's word.

(September 16, 2014 at 6:22 am)pocaracas Wrote: It seems the US military are also thinking that these people only deserve death from above... how poetic.

Our squadron patch from when I was in the 7th Bomb Wing:



To the topic, "But he does this!" is ever the refuge of the guilty. Allowing the irrational, of any stripe, to operate the levers of power is a sure recipe for atrocity.