(October 17, 2014 at 2:52 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 2:50 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Neither a sperm cell nor unfertilized egg have in-themselves the potential to develop and actualize human potential. What makes the fertilized egg a human is its potential to grown and develop as a human from the first instant of its being to its last breath as a mature adult.

The fact of spontaneous abortions is a fact to consider when balancing the human rights of the unborn versus those of the woman carrying the unborn. It is a grave and callous mistake to assume that the unborn have absolutely no rights whatsoever.

So we're back to the point of where you think human life begins. It it conception? You didn't respond to my earlier post so I'll just re-ask here.

Of course it begins at conception and no it is not arbitrary for the reasons I gave. It is basic biology.

(October 17, 2014 at 2:58 pm)ChadWooters Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 2:52 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: So we're back to the point of where you think human life begins. It it conception? You didn't respond to my earlier post so I'll just re-ask here.

Of course it begins at conception and no it is not arbitrary for the reasons I gave. It is basic biology.

So you'd say human life and personhood begin at conception. Where's the 'basic biology' that you're using to justify that?

(October 17, 2014 at 2:17 pm)Dolorian Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 12:56 pm)Chas Wrote: The scientific basis is the presence of a brain and nervous system.

Would you consider it a person at the point during development when the brain begins to form? Around the 3-4 week if I recall correctly.

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(October 17, 2014 at 1:16 pm)Brian37 Wrote: ...sperm is ALIVE otherwise it would not swim. The "conception" is an arbitrary starting point you picked.

Hmm, no it is not arbitrary, there is a substantial change which occurs at conception that results in the beginning of the development of a new individual.

Quote:You are not for quality of life if all you give a fuck about is a zygote. Life after birth matters a fuckload more, and if you don't have the money to raise all the kids from pregnancy then SHUT THE FUCK UP! Still not your body in any case. You are not the morality police of the world and you do not own the world so again FUCK OFF! You are a fucking idiot bleeding heart stupidly thinking girls/women do it just to throw a fucking party as if they get joy having one. Then you fucking morons never pony up with a punishment for the girl/women because they are involved in that decision too. Then you still do not give one fuck about any health problems the kid or mother might have nor do you give a fuck about either after the birth. SO AGAIN FUCK YOU AND FUCK OFF YOU SELFISH NARCISSISTIC PRICK!

Come on Brian, let's try and keep things civil

It will remain civil as long as they mind their own fucking business.

It is really childish of the pro lifers to think that life is a utopia and anyone that does not do what they want is evil. Economically they are too fucking stupid to see by outlawing it it will make things worse, not better. Girls and women do not fuck just so they can kill something. All making it illegal will do is compound the issue and kill more girls and women.

They are also too stupid to understand that pro choice people ALSO want to reduce unwanted pregnancy and ARE concerned about the health of the girl/woman AND most importantly quality of life after birth.

This crap is nothing more than seeking a utopia that will never exist. It is as delusional as thinking Isis has the right to demand the world submit to Allah.

(October 17, 2014 at 2:59 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 2:58 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: Of course it begins at conception and no it is not arbitrary for the reasons I gave. It is basic biology.

So you'd say human life and personhood begin at conception. Where's the 'basic biology' that you're using to justify that?

Basic Biology

I specifically did not say that 'personhood', whatever that means, starts at conception.

(October 17, 2014 at 4:15 pm)ChadWooters Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 2:59 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: So you'd say human life and personhood begin at conception. Where's the 'basic biology' that you're using to justify that?

Basic Biology

I specifically did not say that 'personhood', whatever that means, starts at conception.

Not even close. The first sentence of that link already assumes the embryo is the beginning of human life. The only thing that link seeks to "prove" is that the embryo exists immediately at one cell. The proof of life isn't present at all.

(October 17, 2014 at 4:43 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: The proof of life isn't present at all.

What do you mean by "life"?

Whatever Chad is claiming to begin at conception. He's the one trying to prove it.

(October 17, 2014 at 4:15 pm)ChadWooters Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 2:59 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote: So you'd say human life and personhood begin at conception. Where's the 'basic biology' that you're using to justify that?

Basic Biology

I specifically did not say that 'personhood', whatever that means, starts at conception.

Bullshit and you know it.

If biology were label dependent then we would teach Christian evolution, or Muslim evolution or Jewish evolution.

If you don't know when personhoood happens then SHUT THE FUCK UP.

In reality the viability of ALL life is a range. The abundant life you perceive is actually the MINORITY of attempts.

(October 17, 2014 at 2:17 pm)Dolorian Wrote:

(October 17, 2014 at 12:56 pm)Chas Wrote: The scientific basis is the presence of a brain and nervous system.

Would you consider it a person at the point during development when the brain begins to form? Around the 3-4 week if I recall correctly.

No, not until there is a functioning brain, about 6+ months.

(October 17, 2014 at 5:43 pm)Brian37 Wrote: If you don't know when personhoood happens then SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Enlighten me then. When does personhood happen? Otherwise reveal yourself as the hypocritical asshole you appear to be.