You can disprove claims made about the being described in the bible, but we can't really say there is no god. The more specific you get with something, the easier it is to disprove. That's why christians want to jump to earlier than the big bang. The big bang needed a banger, therefore Jesus is Lord, forgetting the giant chasm between "divine creator" and Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life".

(April 30, 2015 at 12:07 pm)Salacious B. Crumb Wrote: We can look at things from the bible starting at the beginning: There are two ludicrous, contradicting biblical creation accounts. About 6,000-10,000 years ago, the bible claims Adam and Eve were the first humans on this planet. That differs from scientific fact, that humans are at least 150,000 years old.. Need I go farther?

Also, just straightforward reasoning such as: Where are all the firsthand eyewitness written testimony of jesus's miracles he performed during his life? You would think if the only begotten son of god came to earth and performed miracles, someone would have written about it. Even if there were thousands of written statements, that shouldn't be good evidence to anyone anyway, but you would think at least that much would exist.

The bible disproves itself, that part is obvious. Would you go as far to say as the god of the bible can be disproved using the bible and/or logic? Feel free to quote more infallible passages.

First of all, the creation accounts were likely myths, speaking the truth that there is one God who created everything. This is in contrast to the creation myths of many gods floating around at the time. As far as the accounts of firsthand eyewitnesses go, what are you looking for? The apostle John was an eyewitness and the other writers had access to eyewitnesses. The overwhelming majority of the eyewitnesses couldn't read or write. They passed it on orally for the most part. The Romans, who weren't witnesses to the miracles, would have treated these accounts as you treat the accounts of modern day miracles, and would have dismissed them out of hand. I happen to believe the writings of the bible, either from the writings of eyewitnesses or from the statements of eyewitnesses obtained by the gospel writers. You can't absolutely prove or disprove God to the world. If logic is your only guiding principle, then you probably won't believe in God. Of course our principles of logic are determined by people and not by God. I personally think some findings of quantum physics are illogical. Logic is a worldly principle, and God is other than worldly, so to believe in God, one must go beyond what he can demonstrate in a lab. And even atheists make assumptions that are not provable. It all depends on how far we're willing to venture out of the little world that we can perceive in front of our eyes and consider the world that includes whatever exists beyond the boundaries of the universe.

The thing is, even if the God of the bible showed up, there's no way you could accurately identify him from a shoddy textual account. Christians wouldn't know him from your garden variety powerful shape shifting mind control alien.

Poor Lek...you believe and edit your bullshit at the same time.  Must suck to have to go through life making excuses all the time?

I'm thinking my remaining unstruck by lightning after some of the scatological items I have posted about his boy Jesus might put an upper limit on the probabilities that god exists.

Maybe not strictly speaking. But Christianity is such a convoluted, primitive, logically absurd, internally inconsistent, plagiarized mess, I feel perfectly justified in making the positive assertion that Yaweh does not exist. I won't say that about a deistic God but Yaweh is too ridiculous to take seriously.

(April 30, 2015 at 12:31 pm)robvalue Wrote: If the bible is meant to accurately describe a being, then it is a contradictory account, so such a thing cannot exist as far as our logic will allow.

That is how I feel. I realize that you can't disprove a god, fairies, or invisible dragons. According to the bible, god is infallible and every word of that book is true. When things that I've mentioned from the bible in my original post contradict each other, The Law of Contradiction states that both premises can't be true, therefore one premise is true. If you look at the facts, you will see humans didn't pop into existence 10,000 years ago. I can spend all day going through the bible and give you at least 100 contradictions, therefore every word of his book isn't true, therefore the god of the bible doesn't exist, because he no longer would be infallible. That's how I see it anyway. Some things are true in it, but not everything.

(April 30, 2015 at 1:08 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Poor Lek...you believe and edit your bullshit at the same time.  Must suck to have to go through life making excuses all the time?

Tell me what "excuses" I just made Mini. I gave my opinion and backed it up. Why do you label that as making excuses?

(April 30, 2015 at 1:05 pm)Lek Wrote: It all depends on how far we're willing to venture out of the little world that we can perceive in front of our eyes and consider the world that includes whatever exists beyond the boundaries of the universe.

By "consider", you mean "make up stuff about".

(April 30, 2015 at 1:27 pm)Salacious B. Crumb Wrote: That is how I feel. I realize that you can't disprove a god, fairies, or invisible dragons. According to the bible, god is infallible and every word of that book is true. When things that I've mentioned from the bible in my original post contradict each other, The Law of Contradiction states that both premises can't be true, therefore one premise is true. If you look at the facts, you will see humans didn't pop into existence 10,000 years ago. I can spend all day going through the bible and give you at least 100 contradictions, therefore every word of his book isn't true, therefore the god of the bible doesn't exist, because he no longer would be infallible. That's how I see it anyway. Some things are true in it, but not everything.

Where does the bible claim that every word in it is true?