The "not all Muslims are terrorists" fallacy

[Catholic_Lady]

I don't agree with what he's saying, don't get me wrong. And perhaps I'm being a little too defensive of him because he's a friend, and was reacting to him being called an idiot.

I get that, but urging the deaths of folks is obnoxious on its face, friendship or no. Of all people, a bisexual atheist should be attuned to the idea that killing people out of ideology is bullshit.

I agree.

[rado84]

I get that, but urging the deaths of folks is obnoxious on its face, friendship or no. Of all people, a bisexual atheist should be attuned to the idea that killing people out of ideology is bullshit.

I agree.

Tan, I said it before and I'll say it again: come to live here longer than 5 years in order to get the whole picture and when you see the attitude the muslims demonstrate for all Bulgarians, only then you can judge me - until then I don't give a sh.t what you or anyone else thinks about me. We give them shelter far from war and for gratitude they kill or rape young Bulgarian girls just because they can and because their sick religion allows them to; as for the Bulgarian men, they see us as some sort of slaves, altough we're far from that in reality. When you talk (or try to talk) to such a pig, he won't let you look at his eyes, if you don't want to be stabbed, which already happened once. Fortunately I don't speak to them even if they speak to me, so I'm not threatened by a horrible meaningless religious death.
As for your last post, it has nothing to do with ideology. It's only about wishing to keep my freedom and my way of life as they are right now. Which will not last long, whenever those sick bastards take over Europe and bring it to its knees.

[pocaracas]

Today, on the Onion:

Hundreds of immigrants crossing into Europe from Africa and the Middle East have risked injury and death seeking a new life for their families. Here is the step-by-step process by which they emigrate and the hardships they face on their journey:

Step 1: Families make spur-of-the-moment decision to leave behind the opportunity, safety, creature comforts, and overall happy existence in their native land to mooch off resources of European governments
Step 2: Pack a few granola bars and a bottle of water for the long trip
Step 3: Human traffickers assure group of immigrants that boat carrying them across Mediterranean is meant to hold this many people
Step 4: Scare the shit out of some sunbathers on a Greek beach
Step 5: Arriving refugees fill out one-part questionnaire on whether they intend to destroy Europe
Step 6: Trudging
Step 7: Migrants blend in by joining a protest disparaging their ethnicity and culture
Step 8: Hightail it through Hungary as quickly as possible
Step 9: Parents traveling with young children repeatedly assure themselves kids’ long-term memory capacity hasn’t kicked in yet
Step 10: Angela Merkel bestows each migrant with their new German name
Step 11: Migrants who fled Islamic terrorists decide to just go ahead and become Islamic terrorists in new country

Loved step 11!

[Lemonvariable72]

Today, on the Onion:

Hundreds of immigrants crossing into Europe from Africa and the Middle East have risked injury and death seeking a new life for their families. Here is the step-by-step process by which they emigrate and the hardships they face on their journey:

Step 1: Families make spur-of-the-moment decision to leave behind the opportunity, safety, creature comforts, and overall happy existence in their native land to mooch off resources of European governments
Step 2: Pack a few granola bars and a bottle of water for the long trip
Step 3: Human traffickers assure group of immigrants that boat carrying them across Mediterranean is meant to hold this many people
Step 4: Scare the shit out of some sunbathers on a Greek beach
Step 5: Arriving refugees fill out one-part questionnaire on whether they intend to destroy Europe
Step 6: Trudging
Step 7: Migrants blend in by joining a protest disparaging their ethnicity and culture
Step 8: Hightail it through Hungary as quickly as possible
Step 9: Parents traveling with young children repeatedly assure themselves kids’ long-term memory capacity hasn’t kicked in yet
Step 10: Angela Merkel bestows each migrant with their new German name
Step 11: Migrants who fled Islamic terrorists decide to just go ahead and become Islamic terrorists in new country

Loved step 11!

I know the article is being funny, but why would you think this isn't being used as opportunity to plant terrorists everywhere? Or that these people will integrate into society at all? Or that less then 20% are islamists?

[Napoléon]

I know the article is being funny, but why would you think this isn't being used as opportunity to plant terrorists everywhere? Or that these people will integrate into society at all? Or that less then 20% are islamists?

Right?

All these 'migrants' are here to help and love.

[robvalue]

I wonder why more people don't have a line of thought like this:

"Man, those extremists are mental! And they say all their violence can be justified using the Koran. That's ridiculous, let me see... Oh. They're right. This is a horrible book. Why am I associating with this religion at all? I'm going to make my own version of personal worship, with my own values and my own idea about God. This book is clearly horrific and I should stop endorsing it."

Naive, I know. So naive. I know it's not that simple.

[Lemonvariable72]

I know the article is being funny, but why would you think this isn't being used as opportunity to plant terrorists everywhere? Or that these people will integrate into society at all? Or that less then 20% are islamists?

Right?

All these 'migrants' are here to help and love.

Of course they are. They are 100& moderate liberal Muslims here to enlighten our white culture and if you question that your islamophobic, racist pig

[pocaracas]

Rob, they do that, but they think of more divisions within the muslim religion...

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@lemmon, of course that, as long as they're not settled, many more than 20% will be angry at the "host" countries.
Once they are settled... I don't know.. depends on how they are arranged, I guess. If in ghettos, then yeah, for sure... things will be stupidly difficult to control.
If the people with the money decide to spread them around so that only a handful of muslim families stay in a given town, then I'd wager that they will integrate into the community.

The 20% islamists sounds too much. If they are islamists, they would have remained in Syria, doing their jobs there. Some, indeed may attempt to come to Europe - that's why the borders are closing, to try to ID these guys and keep them in check. They should be a small minority... and, if the majority get settled in separate places these islamists will have a hard time recruiting and spewing their speech of hatred.

[robvalue]

Right. But why do they have to still call it Islam?

If it was me, I'd want nothing to do with the "brand name" at all. I'd just do my own search for truth, so as not to be propping up a particular demented cult.

While they cling to the name and they spread the oral myths about the book somehow being magical, they propagate the problem. They edit the book in their head, but not in reality. If all their beliefs basically contradict what it says in the book, what are they still doing with it?

Naive again, I know. It's all so clear from outside the bubble.

[Napoléon]

@lemmon, of course that, as long as they're not settled, many more than 20% will be angry at the "host" countries.
Once they are settled... I don't know.. depends on how they are arranged, I guess. If in ghettos, then yeah, for sure... things will be stupidly difficult to control.
If the people with the money decide to spread them around so that only a handful of muslim families stay in a given town, then I'd wager that they will integrate into the community.

History has shown that the majority of muslim communities in the west are not integrated, and this trend doesn't seem to be changing. That's the main problem for me.

If every fucker was here for a better life and seemed grateful for being here, I wouldn't really take much of an issue with what's happening right now. But a lot of these 'migrants' seem to think they've got a god given right to come and use European healthcare, UK healthcare, and social care, and all these other benefits. The PC crowd fucking hate someone bringing it up, but it's something that is seriously fucking off a hell of a lot of European people. A Somalian with 7 kids can get housed by the council with a click of the fingers but someone who's been on the waiting list for 10+ years, and is effectively homeless, doesn't get a foot in.

And I think it's reasonable to assume at least a few of these migrants may have connections with ISIS, and those who try to play down this threat are fucking deluded.

http://www.wnd.com/2015/09/isis-smuggler...rate-west/

http://news.yahoo.com/islamists-germany-...BHNlYwNzcg

ISIS SMUGGLER: 'WE WILL USE REFUGEE CRISIS TO INFILTRATE WEST'
4,000 covert terrorists already in place 'awaiting' orders

We know ISIS is dedicated to the destruction of western civilisation and has already killed European citizens, and already planned attacks on European soil, and flat out shout from the rooftops that THEY ARE COMING OVER HERE, but we see all these people coming from the exact region ISIS operates in and yet somehow I'm the bad guy if I say "um, maybe not everyone is a refugee", or "maybe we should have better control over European borders", or "maybe we should just exercise a bit of damn caution when inviting 20,000 unidentifiable people into the country".

I'm also annoyed by the misuse of words in this whole thing. Notice how people interchangeably use the word 'migrant' and 'refugee'. Genuine refugees, I am happy for the UK to do their fair share and take some of them in. Regular, economic migrants don't get such an entitlement though, and if they're coming here they should come under some level of inspection and assessment instead of the open arm approach that Europe is being guilt tripped into currently. And I'm annoyed once more by the shaming for anyone who voices displeasure about these 'migrants' who come in on boats, or that come in via 'people smuggling'. You need upwards of 3k to get on one of those boats, or in league with these smugglers according to media reports and you also have the choice to do it, regardless of what anyone says. IMO the UK has enough poor and homeless people of our own, that we don't really have a responsibility to take in thousands of people who all come from a culture that is diametrically opposed to western society, and bring them into a country that is supposedly going through economic strain and that can barely cope with it's current healthcare system as it is. Let's open the fucking borders and let every fucker and his dog in because it's the human thing to do?

Yeah, it doesn't really help the problem. So all the people crying for 'humanity', where are you all of the rest of the time?

Watch the following.

The 20% islamists sounds too much. If they are islamists, they would have remained in Syria, doing their jobs there.

No, not really. They obviously want to attack European culture. They've told us as much. Makes perfect sense that they'd use this opportunity to get into European countries and attack.

Some, indeed may attempt to come to Europe - that's why the borders are closing, to try to ID these guys and keep them in check.

Yeah and they should close the effing border if you ask me. It's getting beyond a joke. The entirety of Kent was basically in shutdown because of all the migrants coming in from Calais.

The worst thing Europe did was opening up the borders IMO. All that happens is every other country in Europe lets migrants make their way to Calais and then they dump it on the UK like it's our problem.

Or better yet, it's "Europe's problem". God am I sick of hearing this line.

/endrant